Be Careful About This . . .

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If you like to buy used cars, you may also like to pay cash. It’s a great way to convince a seller you’re serious – and ready to deal. Unfortunately – these days – it can also lead to literally unimaginable trouble. Not from the seller. Not even from street thugs.steal lead

But from the thugs acting color of “the law” – who wear state-issued costumes and drive state-issued vehicles.

Let’s say you’re going to try to close a deal on a car you saw advertised. You e-mailed or spoke with the owner on the phone. The vehicle sounds like the ticket and the price he’s asking is in the ballpark as far as what you’d like to pay. So, you arrange to meet up – with the intention of buying the thing if it’s as-advertised, checks out mechanically and if you and the seller can agree on a fair price.

Prior to heading out, you stop by your bank to get the money for the deal out of your account. If the amount is $10,000 or more, the bank – now a de facto agent of the government – will (by law) report that to the government. It is deemed inherently “suspicious” merely to withdraw that sum of your own money from your own account. But that’s not the big danger. The big danger comes when you leave the bank and head out to check out the car you’re interested in buying.steal 4

Let’s say you get stopped along the way for a minor traffic offense. During the “your papers, please” rigmarole, the cop notices the envelope with the cash for your purchase sitting on the seat beside you. Uh-oh. That is more than merely suspicious. It is in fact legally sufficient provocation for the cop to seize your money. It is regarded as prima facie evidence of “drug activity.” No additional or corroborating evidence (such as actual drugs in the car) is required. Merely to be found in possession of more cash than the cops (and courts) arbitrarily decree to be in excess of what “common people … carry” is enough – in the words of Tennessee thug-in-costume (that is, “officer”) Larry Bates, who relieved NJ insurance adjuster George Reby of $22,000 (story here) merely because Reby was found to be carrying $22,000 in cash during a probable cause-free search of his vehicle in the wake of a traffic stop. According to Bates, Reby “could not prove (the money) was legitimate.”

So Bates simply took the money.steal 3

In other words, it’s up to us to prove that whatever cash we have is “legitimate” – else the state’s badged goons can just take it. This is called civil forfeiture by the organized gangs who justify their depredations under color of law.

You may never see your money again – and even if you do, be assured, it will take a great deal of your time and effort (and more of your money) to get it back. In Reby’s case, he had to travel all the way back to TN from NJ in order to plead with the state thugs to return his money – which they eventually (and clearly, begrudgingly) did.steal 6

And Reby’s ordeal is not a case of a thug cop acting beyond his authority. This sort of thing is now happening routinely –  as deliberate policy – and the courts have amen’d it as ok.

Consider the case of Texas resident Javier Gonzales. He was on his way to buy a used car (he owned a used car lot at the time) and was carrying $10,032 in a briefcase. He was pulled over by two Texas costumed highwaymen – members of the state-sanctioned gang that calls itself the Jim Wells County Task Force – for the crime of not having a front license plate on his vehicle. Gonzales made the error of answering yes when the gang members queried him as to whether he was carrying “large amounts of money.” Naturlich, a drug sniffing dog was then brought up – and it “signaled” the presence of drugs. No actual drugs were found during the subsequent seizure of Gonzales’ car – and his cash.

Here’s a look at how the process works; it’s a different case – but the tactics are the same:

Gonzales was eventually presented with a “waiver” that gave him the opportunity to “sign over his money” and go free – or face arrest for money-laundering. Again, no evidence of anything was produced   – let alone presented to a court. It was sufficient merely to have money – and that the thugs-in-blue (cammo, lately) wanted it.steal 5

A bewildered Gonzalez later told NPR:

“So at that time we got in our car and we left, still trying to figure out what just happened. We got officers that took our cash. We got officers that told us we can’t get an attorney. So I’m thinking, are these guys officers of law? Did I just get robbed of my money?”  (Italics added.)

Yes, Mr. Gonzales – that’s exactly what happened.

And it could just as easily happen to you, too.

Gonzales eventually got his money back – after hiring an attorney and spending a great deal of money and time pursuing his case through the courts. But the fact that it was taken under color of law and that asset forfeiture laws have not been repealed or even scaled back but in fact been implemented with ever-increasing aggressiveness is the thing to take away from all of this.steal last

America has become a country littered with laws – but which has become essentially a lawless place. It is no longer necessary for the law enforcers to have evidence – tangible, external, substantive –   that some law has been violated. It is enough for them merely to wish to take what you have, merely because you have it – and they do not.

So, be very, very careful when you next go used car shopping. The thugs are out there, just itching to make you “stand and deliver.”

Throw it in the Woods?

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  1. They have made it impossible to conduct yourself openly, honestly, and with dignity. Bargain, barter, and button-up.
    – – – –
    Temple TX Molon Labe March For C.J. Grisham

    Call (254) 298-5500, ask for Temple Police Chief Gary Smith, and demand he give C.J. Grisham his gun back.

    “A body of men holding themselves accountable to nobody ought not to be trusted by anybody.” – Thomas Paine

    I Do Not Carry A Weapon Because…

    Temple Police Chief Gary Smith’s Respone To The March

  2. These days everyone has to think of the police as criminals, thieves, and murderers. Do everything possible to prevent or shorten contact with them.

  3. Years back my wife did her Paralegal internship under a local attorney named Elenor Miller. Ms. Miller was, by then doing only ‘conventional’ criminal defence cases. For years previous to that, Ms. Miller had become a noted specialist in Civil Forfeiture.

    The game was so profoundly rigged, and the courts (including the USSC removing “innocent owner” defence) to complicit that she simply could no longer stomach telling her clients that the State had simply robbed them; fair-and-square. The look on their faces, and their broken hearts, finances, etc. was too much to bear.

  4. Watching the news around these parts would make you believe that Meth is a new and huge problem. (it’s not new or huge at least not here) Not a day goes by that they don’t bust somebody for a “one pot” lab. Along with the bust comes the “Police confiscated guns and cash valued at” line. At this point it’s taken for granted that it’s “moral” for the police to steal from it’s victims. Guns and cash are simply assumed to be part of the crime. Forget that these guns might have belonged to their grandfather and that they don’t even have ammo for them. As much as the theft of cash bothers me it’s stealing their guns that really pisses me off. You can go out and earn more cash but you can’t bring your grandfather back so he can give you another gun.

    Just remember it’s a war on some drugs and some people and that the victors are allowed their plunder and the victims need to shut up or they will get treated even worse.

    • I might have mentioned this in the past, but around these parts (Southeastern Arizona), Meth is (supposedly) the big “scourge drug” too. Funny thing is, the pig pen five miles up the road from my place was opened the year before I moved here supposedly because Meth was such a huge, overwhelming problem that the county just had to have a company of the “county’s finest” dedicated to our little rural neck of the woods just to stamp it out.

      The funny thing is, though, that in the nearly seven years I’ve lived here, I have not heard or read of ONE single Meth lab being busted or shut down in this area. Not ONE. Sure, I’ve heard of some individuals in the area busted for possession of Meth (oh, the HORROR!), but never an entire lab busted and shut down, with confiscation of huge quantities of finished product, supplies, or weapons. For all I know, several of my immediate neighbors might be operating labs in their barns or storage sheds and frankly, I couldn’t give less of a shit if I squeezed my sphincter into the diameter of the eye of a needle. The only time I’d ever be concerned is if one of their little homemade labs blew up, and even then only if my property was directly affected by it.

      So what, then, does the company of the “county’s finest” do with themselves each day, not having any Meth labs to shut down or narco-entrepreneurs to bust?

      Why, they mostly lurk on the sides of the rural local highways and bust motorists for driving 5-10 MPH over the arbitrarily low posted speed limit, especially when there are no other vehicles in sight and when the local “school zone” is devoid of any children for miles in any direction.

      Surprising, huh?

      • Sounds about right. Around here I have also never heard of a big bust. It’s always what they are calling a “one pot” cook. From the pictures its done in a two liter bottle. There probably isn’t much of a supply so the few junkies around here make their own. As far as I can see the biggest problem is that it’s illegal so they dump their chemicals out in the woods. Make it legal and somebody will come along and make it cheap and without the need to dump crap all over.

  5. Don’t deal with banks don’t use more than 9,999$ Bankers are the lowest form of reptilian grabastic pieces of shit in the food chain and you’ll be better off without them.

  6. I don’t want to drive at night anymore, due to recent police experiences. It really is quite an unnerving feeling, realizing that we really are not free. I feel like getting in a car initiates a dangerous game of hide-and-seek with cops.

    Friend of mine loves cops. He’s understands the whole government control thing, but he still loves cops (that ‘hero’ mentality). We always disagree on police methods/tactics, and law-breaking (which he claims is nearly always justified, so long as it’s not unreasonable, but he naturally cannot define where that line should be drawn). I’ve shown him articles like this before, from this site, and he calls their abuses of power, “perks of the job”, and calls this site radical and anti-cop.

    Give up on him?

    • I am anti-cop!

      And that’s a radical position in a society that no longer understands the difference between a peace officer… and a cop.

      Your friend apparently hasn’t given much real thought to these issues. To describe abuse of authority as “perks of the job” just slays me.

      Perhaps ask him how he’d feel if a cop abused him? Would he still be ok with that as a “perk” of the job?

      • Perhaps ask him how he’d feel if a cop abused him? Would he still be ok with that as a “perk” of the job?

        As I said in a previous post, this is exactly what needs to happen to more and more white, middle-class Amoricons. Until the “non-poodle” class starts suffering the abuses that up until now have mostly been inflicted upon those elements of society that the majority doesn’t like/doesn’t see, none of these abuses are ever going to stop.

        No, this is not something that I want to see happen, but I can’t imagine that, realistically, there is any other way that things will change.

      • He has yet to be pulled over. He thinks of policing as just another career choice, and their blatant hypocrisy of breaking the laws they enforce as perks. He’s pretty innocent to the /other/ things police have done and can do.

        It’s hard to explain. I’ve gone there, and whenever I make the final point of the argument, he replies, “Eh”. As if, “I have no more to say but you’re full of shit and I don’t believe you”.

        I do think I’ll just quit trying with him. It’s exhausting and depressing.

  7. Murray Rothbard once called the state “a gang of thieves writ large.” In the modern day, the police are the “soldiers” for the state mafia. No self-respecting society should ever permit the police to be involved in anything except cases where a person has clearly caused harm to another or damaged their property. Yet, these days, the police are into everything “just because.” And, sadly, the majority of idiots in this country fall down and worship the cops and military because “they keep us free and safe.” Free of having to figure out what to spend our money on and safe from exercising our real freedoms and rights. I’d get out of America, if I could. At least the “corrupt” police overseas are content with taking proportional bribes most of the time, instead of everything you have, and don’t play commando by busting down the wrong door at 3 am looking for non-corporate pharmaceuticals.

    • At least the “corrupt” police overseas are content with taking proportional bribes most of the time, instead of everything you have, and don’t play commando by busting down the wrong door at 3 am looking for non-corporate pharmaceuticals.

      Not only that, but these “corrupt” cops in other countries (and not just “Third World” countries either) are, in my experience, at least HONEST AND UP FRONT about what they’re doing. They don’t cloak it in bullshit rhetoric about “foiling terrists,” or “shutting down drug dealers.” They steal because they can. They also don’t, as you point out, strip you of everything you have either. In fact, most foreign cop corruption of the “bribe your way out of a ticket/arrest” is very subtle, almost business-like. I’ve never seen it involve any kind of coercive violence.

      I recall an incident I was involved in in Izmir, Turkey (BTW, do not EVER drive in a Turkish city if you can avoid it) thirty-odd years ago where I parked in a no-parking zone on a busy thoroughfare because there was simply nowhere else on the street to park. I knew it wouldn’t end well, but I figured I’d chance it anyway. Sho ’nuff, as soon as I finished conducting the business I needed to do and returned to my car, there was a cop scribbling out a piece of “pay up” paper. Through an acquaintance whose Turkish was less mangled than mine, I asked about the penalty. The cop said that for 10,000 lira (about U.S. $20.00), he could make the ticket go away. Lucky me (and him), I just happened to have had that amount of cash in my wallet. I gave him the money, he tore up the ticket, I was on my merry way, and NO HARM DONE TO ANYONE.

      • Yup – in Mexico this is called (IIRC) the “mordita” (sp?)… and it’s very business-like. No crap-speech about “safety.” Just hand the man a $20 and be on your way….

        • Yeah, mordida, literally, “the bite”. I’d prefer that to what we have. Mexican cops know that old saying, “you can shear a sheep over and over, but you can only skin him once”.

          • Agree. As bad as the “road tax” is, spare me the unctuous lectures and prattling about saaaaaaaaaaefty. Just take the fucking money, asshole.

          • Ed, Eric – I have Mexican friends and I like to point out to them that the only difference between the Mexican government and the U.S. government is that rank and file Mexicans know the system is corrupt and deal with it accordingly. Here, altogether too many Amerikans still think that our “public servants” are doing what is right, what is best for the nation, protecting, serving, blah, blah, blah. I call BS! With the rare exception, they are just there following orders for a paycheck. And too many are also there because they are nosy busy-bodies and control freaks who want to lord it over the rest of us. Remember, if you can’t do anything else, you can always be a cop.

            So I’m with you: I’d rather hand over a $20, $50 or even $100 and be on my way. No processing through the system, no wasted time, no lawyers’ fees. Just pay the friggin’ toll and move on. How hard is that? It would be my luck that I’d get some principled ass like the trooper I used to live near in Virginia; a former marine and stickler for “the law.” To his credit he didn’t play favorites. After warning his wife about her “lead foot” she got a speeding ticket (odd for a cop’s wife to have that happen I realize, must’ve been Karma). She asked him to “fix it” for her. Instead he made her go to court, face the judge and pay the fine. She divorced him. Imagine that. But he’s not the kind of guy you want to hand a folded C-note to with your license. Not that I condone any of it, but at least south of the border it’s expected. Up here good ol’ honest bribery is still playing Russian Roulette.

          • eric, Boothe, Ed, when I visited friends in Mexico the first thing I found about was cutting through red tape. Nearly anything you want to do requires padding someone’s pocket, just make sure you don’t pad too hard or you won’t find the final pocket. When the big scam about Walmart came out about them bribing Govt. officials in Mexico to get permission to build stores I was ROTFLMAO. What a bunch of dolts. There are free bano’s on the streets and that’s where gimme’s stop. I was amazed there were so many, got sorta used to pedestrians walking behind my exposed back, nearly had a crick in my neck after a while.

  8. Cops: thugs with guns and government clown costumes. The biggest criminal gang in America. In case anyone needs a reminder (it seems most people here already understand), visit any day of the year. Cops also tend to be the biggest cowards on the face of the earth, shitting their pants at the thought of being recorded while they’re engaging in their predations. I try not to think of any group as genuinely sub-human, but cops make this label hard to avoid.

    • Cops have an illusion to maintain. Recording them can serve to break that illusion. The Illusions that have been created are the most important things to those of the state, those who benefit from the state, and those who believe in the state (often by believing the illusions).

  9. Last used vehicle I bought, we did the cash exchange and title xfer at my bank. Manager notarized the signature on the title, and they certainly had some evidence that their suspicious transaction report was a waste of time and paper.

    The former owner (and guy leaving the bank with the cash) was on his own for avoiding the road-side-tax-collectors.

    Cops, the modern-day highwaymen (thieves and murderers).

  10. Let’s call asset forfeiture what it is: theft. These state sanctioned highwaymen know that the majority of their victims either can’t or won’t challenge the crime committed against them. I read about a case down in Florida years ago where an elderly widow (old enough to have lived through the depression and not trust banks) was on her way to buy her retirement home with her late husband’s life insurance pay out. As I recall she missed her exit and crossed the highway through a service lane rather than drive miles to the next exit. Because she wasn’t driving an “authorized vehicle” the local badged publicans pulled her over. Apparently using a service lane, that was paid for with our tax money, to change direction is in itself an act indicative of drug activity. So exercising their powers of armed intimidation, these pre-crime heroes stole her money. She had to hire a lawyer to fight it and won. But absent any other “evidence” than cash on hand, there was no reason to steal from her other than the hope that the “agency” would get to keep her property.

    There was another case in California where a landowner was awakened in the middle of the night by a home invasion. It turned out to be the Sheriff’s department raiding his property on “suspicion” of marijuana. When the man came down the stairs he grabbed an unloaded antique pistol off the wall and was summarily executed. His widowed sued and during the ensuing investigation, it was determined that our “protectors” had a tax map up with highlighted tracts and their monetary values on display. They were in the business of targeting properties for forfeiture based on market value, not any a real suspicion of drug “crime” (even if there were such a thing).

    Power corrupts. Absolute power corrupts absolutely. All asset forfeiture laws that do anything other than restore property or make restitution to the private victims of actual crimes need to be immediately repealed. These laws are nothing but a license to steal.

    • Don’t hold your breath Boothe. I lost a few thou that way. Was it worth hiring a lawyer? I guess not since two of them I’d hired could have cared less. I used to go to auctions and take 10k-15k in cash. As I made money I added what I got in sales for cash back to the pot and kept the total pretty high, a completely illegal thing in the new USSA. Of course I ALWAYS paid taxes on what I earned. That’s my story, sticking to it.

      • Was it worth hiring a lawyer? I guess not since two of them I’d hired could have cared less.

        Most lawyers are worse than useless. Few of them have any actual litigation experience and almost all of them are deathly afraid of a courtroom or of having to challenge the system (I actually read an article written by a “defense” attorney several years ago where the guy said something to the effect of “the last thing you want to do as a defense attorney is piss of the prosecutor.” [SARCASM]JUST the kind of “defense” attorney I’d spend my hard-earned cash one[/SARCASM]). In criminal law, this explains the city blocks of “plea factories” that line the main street surrounding a courthouse. Most civil litigators are also lazy shysters. If your case doesn’t fit a template where they can easily settle out of court, they won’t even look at your case.

        Fuck ALL of them.

        • what about the lawyer who challenges the constitutionality of alimony?

          A lawyer who asserts that a probate court judge does not have subject matter jurisdiction to preside over the question of confiscating the property of one former spouse in order to give it to the other, has, by definition, a giant pair.

          what about the lawyer who challenges the constitutional authority of a medical licensing board to discipline a doctor for offering an alternative therapy like H2O2 IV therapy?

          what about a lawyer who defends those wrongly accused of rape or sexual assault or pedophilia?

          • Let me just ask this: What are the serious odds of ANYBODY who requires legal counsel nowadays, for either civil or criminal matters, winding up with the type of lawyer you describe in these examples, even if they pony up big bucks for one?

            Just about zero.

            More importantly, unless one DOES have a very deep well of “big bucks,” there is almost NO CHANCE of either getting this type of lawyer OR of ANY lawyer succeeding in winning an argument with a positive outcome for the client in these examples.

            IIRC, the last time there was a notable exception to this was the SCOTUS ruling in Gideon vs. Wainwright. A very different era the likes of which we most assuredly won’t see again in our lifetimes.

          • Mike, there are a few, albeit very few, principled lawyers genuinely trying to work through the system for change. Unfortunately most Constitutional lawyers that routinely challenge the status quo, like the folks at the Home School Legal Defense Association, don’t command the salaries nor the settlements that ambulance chasers and other legal predators do. So many of the folks that go to law school are there because the “normal” part of the profession typically pays very well and pays a heartless sociopath exceptionally well. After all, what they do is “legal”, irrespective of whether it is right or wrong. The exceptional part of the profession isn’t quite so lucrative.

            The problem is even greater when you consider the fact that judges are lawyers and a high percentage of legislators are also lawyers. So “the system” has in no small part been set up by lawyers to reward lawyers. Since lawyers do not produce any tangible goods or provide any services apart from “practicing law”, the only way they can build their “practice” is within the confines of “the law.” So it is in their best interests to have the law sufficiently complex and incomprehensible to the rest of us to where we have no other choice than to employ their services if we have any “legal” issues. And it can take numerous false starts and a lot of wasted money before you ever find a lawyer that will actually do what you want. I’ve been burned like this before. And even after I found a lawyer I could trust, on more than one occasion, he gave me bad advice.

            Back when I was more politically active, I questioned some “Constitutional” lawyers about why they didn’t take a direct Constitutional approach to the issues we were fighting since it is arguably the Supreme Law of the Land, They explained that isn’t how the system works, You can’t just argue the plain language of the Constitution. You have to work with case law or precedents, statutory law and regulations. And it has to be done with specific language, in a specific format and protocol must be followed. It’s all very complicated you see. They were heavily invested in this system and the thought that “the law” should be simple and straight forward enough for the average person to understand it was apparently foreign to them. Sadly, It would appear that this is the position most regular folks have been conditioned to accept as well.

            So while it is true that there are principled, honest and even self sacrificing attorneys fighting the good fight, they are few and far between. They truly are the exception rather than the rule and that is why the profession is so widely despised. Even the Carpenter from Nazareth didn’t care for them much; read Luke chapter eleven some time.

          • “You can’t just argue the plain language of the Constitution. You have to work with case law or precedents, statutory law and regulations. And it has to be done with specific language, in a specific format and protocol must be followed. It’s all very complicated you see.”

            Agreed Boothe. You might be interested in this:


            Unless an issue is unusually complex, I’ll argue the case myself because a decent shyster that WILL argue ACTUAL law in favour of you is almost impossible to find and, is still a shyster. Knowledge is power. Heal thyself, doctor 😉

          • Rev, that’s really good brief. I’ve studied all of this before. The problem is that the rank and file police don’t know these things nor do they understand fundamental rights. So if a cop asks to see your driver’s license here in the USSA and you respond “I’m sorry officer, I wasn’t driving. I was traveling by right in my private conveyance.” there is an overwhelming probability you have just been tagged as a “lifestyle terrorist.” The rest of the encounter will probably involve a Tazer, pepper spray, a wood shampoo (and coincidental closed head injury), manacles, kidnapping and being caged with the most unsavory cell mates the state can muster.

            The reason I offer these discouraging words, is because I have an acquaintance in Virginia who travels by right in his private conveyance. Periodically, the local badged and costumed thugs “detain” him even though he has a court ruling in his possession that he offers to enlighten them with. They usually try to pick him up on Friday evening so he has to sit in the pokey all weekend waiting for the magistrate on Monday. They have to release him once the judge hears his plea and sees the evidence, of course. But I don’t relish the idea of spending the weekend sleeping with one eye open in the company of a “celly” named Ben Dover.

            So although I agree that traveling over the public roads and highways and transporting one’s private property in one’s private conveyance is indeed a right recognized by the courts, is it worth the fight? Perhaps if I were single and younger, I would take this fight up as a matter of moral principle. But one must pick one’s battles carefully. In light of the fact that Steve Anderson (a Baptist pastor from Phoenix, Arizona) had his windows smashed out, was dragged from his car, beaten and Tazed multiple times for attempting to assert his rights in a Constitution free zone, I’m pretty careful to avoid any interaction with the state thugs. Okay, so he finally “won” in court. That’s great. But at what cost? And what did he win? Did he have the thugs that did this to him fired? Were they charged with criminal assault and attempted murder? Kidnapping? No, he didn’t win, Because these thugs are still at large, as well as ready and willing to do it again I assure you.

            If you want to incite state thug involvement in your life, one of the quickest ways to do so is to ride around with no plates on your vehicle. Or better yet a homemade plate with the case number on it where you handed the cops their Constitutional asses (as my acquaintance in the Communist-wealth of Virginia found out). If you have the stomach for it (and the ability to withstand electroshock torture and multiple blunt force trauma sites to your cranium), by all means have at that right to travel thing. As for me, I’ve had enough physical violence against my person for one lifetime and for now at least, I’ll just pay protection to our official version Big Paulie. Or more succinctly, “Who can make war with the beast?”

          • That’s fine Boothe, I understand. There aren’t enough people exercising their rights to open the floodgates for the rest of the country. Most are too scared and the “authorities” make sure of that. It’s a self-serving vicious circle.

            I may be 45 in July, possibly stupid – or bored – but I quite welcome police harassment/attempted extortion at their expense when the recordings are made available to all and sundry. Sure I wouldn’t want to spend the weekend in the clink, but our laws differ here somewhat and I haven’t been studying them deeply over the last 4 years or so for nothing.

            You’ve probably seen Charlie Sprinkle on YouTube, who’s been “travelling” near 40 years without a licence. Cops that antagonised him had Liens placed against their bosses and wives. Very effective, especially when the wives are included.

            I’m definitely not averse to such tactics and will employ them with full force. I’ll be happy to teach everyone that wishes to join me too.

          • As I have stated before, this sort of battle works if one is going to be restricted to one small area and always see the same cops, judges, etc. They can be ‘trained’ that one will fight back and win every time. However, this whole method falls apart when one has to keep dealing with different people.

            For me, just to get to work, I am exposed to nine different police agencies as I recall from the last time I counted it out. That’s a lot of cops to ‘train’. Not to mention judges and the like. Even if everything went to plan I’d lose my employment long before achiving victory. Then I’d have to start practically all over again.

            I also agree with Boothe, what is achieved? Nothing really. They don’t lose their jobs. They don’t stop harassing other people, nothing actually changes.

            The question is, how to get volumes of people to do it all at once? That’s the method that needs development. A few people the system always wins even if it loses those cases. If a million people in cook county Illinois decided to remove the plates from their cars one morning then it could work. I just don’t know how to get to there.

      • Eight, don’t worry. I’m not holding my breath. The system works very well for the folks that work the system, at our expense. Since they are the one’s with more men, more guns and our money, it ain’t likely to change until the whole mess collapses under its own weight. I asked an attorney one time if he was an officer of the court. Of course he responded “Yes.” So then I asked if his first responsibility was to the court and he asked “Where are we going with this?” So I asked him to please humor me. So he said it was. Then I asked if his second priority was to himself and his practice, to which he responded in the affirmative. So at that point I said “So the best I can hope for as a paying client is to come in third.” He pondered that for a moment, then said “Yeah, that’s about right.” At least he was honest about it. So if your interests conflict with the court’s best interests, your lawyer will defer to the interests of the court and you will lose. It has been my experience that he will still send you a bill though.

        • Absolutely! This is in line with an ongoing argument I have had with lawyers over the years. I ask, “Do you own your house?” They answer, “Yeah, it’s paid for so I own it free and clear.” I repond, “No, you don’t. Do you have to pay property taxes to the government every year? What happens if you don’t pay the property taxes (another, and better, word is “protection”)?” Same with your vehicle in some jurisdictions – you have to pay “personal property taxes,” another form of “protection.” They almost all say, at that point, “But you don’t understand – you own it, but the law makes you pay taxes.” To which I respond, “So, exactly how is that different from paying rent? If you don’t pay rent, the landlord can evict you. If you don’t pay property tax, the government (uber-landlord) can evict you, too. What is the difference?” That’s when they usually change the subject. Bottom line: we live in a country where nobody owns anything. You are allowed to have limited use of certain things, but the all-powerful government actually owns everything. At least, that’s the way the think and act.

    • What really kills me is that it is not only so obvious, but that the majority of the sheepletards, in their brainless, reflexive deference to “heeeerrrrrrroes” who “protect and serve,” will simply excuse this without a second thought – until THEY become the target of it.

      This is why part of me hopes that these badged thieves become so emboldened as to start raiding whole neighborhoods at random, carting off anything and everything of any perceived value that they can steal, all without even a pretense of legality. Until such brazen robbery under color of law starts targeting non-poodles routinely, none of this will stop.

      • Lib, I have said the same thing. Once all the statists have been run through the system they’ll have a better understanding of it. If getting run through the “criminal justice”(sic)system doesn’t wise you up, there is no hope.

  11. Better than bitcoin, how about 1 oz gold rounds? At this morning’s spot price of $1377, 7 1oz rounds and 2 1/10oz rounds are worth about $10,000. Much easier to keep hidden from Johnny Law.

    Remember, the reason we can’t have $500 or $1000 notes is because of the “war on drugs.” The drug dealers have to buy empty houses to keep all their cash because the feds think they’ll have a hard time laundering it. Are you a drug dealer? Do you know any drug dealers? Are you a drug user (other than the ones supplied by the FDA approved dealers)? But because of the actions of what is likely less than 1% of the population, once again we’re all inconvenienced.

    BTW, going by their face value ($20), that car is worth $144 in 1920’s dollars. One of the online inflation calculators says $778 though. Maybe gold is in a bubble!

    • “One of the online inflation calculators says $778 though. Maybe gold is in a bubble!”

      Nah, the price has been beaten down by huge naked shorts from the usual suspects. What I say at times like these is, on the spot market, those who have gold aren’t selling and those who are selling have no gold.

      I won’t sell any of my gold coins at that price. A $20 double eagle has about .96 ozt. in AGW. Current spot is $1384.91 so, that amount x .96 = 1329.51, but there’s a coin premium, so add 20% or $265.90 and you have $1595.41. Maybe the quote you read was for a $10 gold eagle, so figure that it’s worth $797.71 in FRNs. I’m referring to the old US gold coins, not the new bullion “eagles”.

  12. “the cop notices the envelope with the cash for your purchase sitting on the seat beside you. Uh-oh. That is more than merely suspicious.”

    Yes, it’s retarded. Anybody who is used to handling cash doesn’t put it in an envelope and leave it out on a car seat. Anybody who handles cash every day, keeps it out of sight. If you’re used to handling cash, you aren’t going to be much of a bank customer, to start with.

    I’m always kind of amazed to see someone who drives a $40k car, and is worth a few grand on the hoof in the way of clothes and jewelry/accessories, kind of panic when they have to count a few grand in C-notes. Of course, driving an expensive car and wearing expensive jewelry is like hanging a “ROB ME, PLEASE” sign around one’s neck, but anyway….

    If you’re doing a cash deal, all the negotiation can take place right out in public, but you need to go inside, into a private place to count out the cash. Most of the people I know are scared of cash. It’s funny. A person who lives really large on paper and doesn’t think that writing a check for $5k has a kind of seizure when they’re handed 50 C-notes. It’s like the paper burns their hands.

    Dealing in cash is hard nowadays since the $100 note is the biggest one in circulation. It makes it tough to carry $100k on your person. Heck, even $10k is kind of bulky. That’s 100 C-notes at about 1 gram each, That’s 3.57, avoirdupois, ounces of paper. That’s a bundle 6 inches log that folds into a big enough wad to show through clothing. You don’t put that into an envelope and leave it lying out in plain sight. You split it into half and put one each into a hip pocket. and sit on it in the car.

    Can you look at a stack of $100 bills and know whether it’s $5k or $6k? Most people can’t. OK, enough talk about cash. I’ll shut up.

    • About three years ago, I found a truck (now my truck) advertised online by a seller in West Virginia – about four hours down the road from me. I went to the bank and withdrew appx. $7,000 because I intended to just ride my motorcycle up there, buy the truck, then drive it back (with my bike tied down in the bed). I could have gotten a cashier’s check for the majority of the purchase and then a few hundred in cash. But I saw no reason to do that. Just easier to count out the money – do the deal – and split. Which is exactly what I did. Luckily for me – in hindsight – I was not stopped for “speeding” or for some other BS reason and subjected to a pat-down (now duly “legal” in this country). The porker could have just taken my money – and then it would have been up to me to try to get it back.

      • It is because of the type of laws at play. When most states (all?) passed forfeiture laws they did not make it part of the criminal prosecution. If the intent of forfeiture laws was to dismantle or disrupt criminal activity they could simply amend the drug laws to include a seizure and forfeiture of all assets related to that operation upon conviction. The reason they made them a civil proceeding is because they can be run independent of any criminal proceeding at a much lower standard of proof. You can be acquitted of all charges and still lose your property in the civil proceeding. They can also delay the civil proceeding until the criminal matter is complete if they think they will win so they can use the criminal act as evidence in the civil case.

        In short the laws were designed to separate you from your money by giving the state the overall best odds. All while ignoring the intention of our right to due process by allowing the state to act like a party to some contract disagreement when in truth any state forfeiture action should hold the same standard as a criminal proceeding.

        • The laws were designed CLEARLY to peel away “constitutional” protections from people.

          It is the height of sophistry to suggest that “money” or “property” do not have legal rights (and can therefore be designated as presumed guilty) but their owners retain legal rights.

          I often wonder how the black-robed clowns who blessed (and continue to bless) all this can look in the mirror to shave. I’d think they’d fall through the looking glass, given their testimony that up is down and words mean whatever they deem, subject to change with the wind.

          We live in a vast criminal society. People accept the criminality because (1) the herd around them does so, and (2) because they think somehow they benefit on net (which is like thinking everyone in the casino is a winner).

          • “We live in a vast criminal society.”

            True, that. I also agree with your statement about the intent of laws. The progressives of the 19th century were able to gain absolute authority over the government and the product of the legislative process, gradually and with a strategy that used the ratchet effect. Each new gain became the baseline for the next gain.

            The progressives were who the old Southerners called “the Yankees”. They were mostly New Englanders, Unitarians (if they had any religion at all) and were the predecessors of today’s authoritarians of both parties.

            It appears that there is a very concentrated push in progress these days for more and more control. I’ve never seen it advance this quickly and it really appears to be happening at every level of government. I live in a rural farming county, the government of which has become boldly aggressive in its growth and authority. The board of supervisors which used to meet monthly now stays in session all the time. The sheriff’s department has grown by half every year since a new sheriff came into office.

            The new sheriff hires new deputies non-stop, all young skinhead combat vets. The department has added so many new Chargers that there’s no place to park them all. There are speed traps all over the county and the circuit court stays jumping all day every day collecting fines. Schools increase the number of days of attendance every year, and school hours also increase yearly. The local high school has instituted so many new rules this year that my kid can’t seem to manage to get through a week without some problem or other.

            It makes me wonder what the fuck is going to happen next.

          • “It makes me wonder what the fuck is going to happen next.”

            They’ll be coming for the guns soon is my guess.

          • You know I’ve photocopied a few 100 dollar bills and post them around the house as a good luck symbol, not for spending as that would be countefeit. Something to do with positive thinking as vision is very good part of it. But going further I decided I’d buy a wallet and leave them there just in case some theives break in and decided they too want some monopoly money to have fun visualizing too.

          • Everyone should have some fake bills in a fake wallet just make sure it says play money or or something in watermark or small print. You can buy a stack of them on Ebay if you want to have some fun feeling rich and its great like I said for the all kinds of theives to let them too feel really rich for a while.

          • “It makes me wonder what the fuck is going to happen next.”

            Actually the correct order is dumb everyone down with flourine/flouride

            Then dumb everyone down with glycophosphate laced wheaties and corn flakes.

            Then when everyone feels a little nauseated and not in their right mind, dumb them down again with some more flourine based prozac and anyone who becomes agitated give them a shot of Halidol because your really sick in the head if you don’t love your government.

            Finally uncle Prez will get on TV the old media no one cares to watch and say how he cares about your safety and either turn in the guns or they’ll have to kill you. << Note most the average will not see the failed logic.

            Some of us will hopefully hold out to hit the reset button either that or use technology against the dumb beast and hope they are consuming their own poisons first. When you see Jimmie Jones handing out the kool-aid make sure to head to the jungles until everyone else has either drank it or Uncle Jimmie has a bullet in his head.

            Hot Rod

          • Oh, I need not say this because you guys are really 140 IQ anyway. But, when you create your fake feel rich wallet make sure you mix it with some real 1’s and 5’s. I remember hearing Irish diplomacy was telling someone to go to hell so they can enjoy the trip. I’d hope that some small time crook not government that held me up at gunpoint would go spend the 100 dummy on a buttefinger right on candid camera.

            Of course carrying fake bills around could be easily dismissed if the cops were to notice by simply saying the truth that you were carrying them around for good Irish luck and also in case you ever got held up for safety reasons. They might not even notice and impound it anyway, like i said everyone has the right to feel rich as its the vision that counts in the short run.

          • I change my opinion don’t carry on the ruse with the police very long and admit the money is play money or they might charge you with some other felony. Its not gooood to play games with these guys, but it does work with small time crooks.

          • Ed did you ever take some trash you couldn’t get rid you know and gift wrap it and leave it the back of the pickup truck unattended in a mall parking lot? I know you southerners and rural types are pretty good at those kinds of jokes. Heard and seen it all. I remember some southern boy I worked with who had chocolates in his desk that kept getting stolen. So he made his own chocolates, the chocolate innards being from the pasture fields. Needless to say the theft ended with a half eaten chocolate left on the desktop. Anyway, if it weren’t for the Irish and southerners I don’t know if I couldve worked those big company jobs as long as I did.

            Cheers all.

          • You left out #3: Because only the GOVERNMENT is allowed to use force to enforce their edicts, regardless of legality, morality, or any other concern. THEIR use of force is always OK; OUR use of force is always illegal.
            Like Franklin said about revolutions: Revolution is Always illegal in the third person: THEIR revolution. It is always legal in the first person: OUR revolution.

            As others have noted: House always wins.
            “Everybody knows” (Leonard Cohen)

    • For decades I used a locking bank bag with the bank’s logo on it but I always hid it somewhere out of sight. For the last 20 years or so I stash cash in a part of my vehicle you could only find if you decided to tear it apart. CholleyJack ensures no police dogs will be in there, at least, not while I’m still breathing. CJ on the porch this morn, barked to come in so I opened the door which is his que to turn and peruse the place for anything he might get to give a good round. We both saw the skunk at the same time and he was off. I started screaming for him to come back not ever letting up. He blasted up on that skunk, legs locked up, hair up and I continued to scream. The skunk turns and gets into position and CJ jumps backward and comes to the house. Good boy, good boy.

    • Ah, yes, I see your point. Anyone who doesn’t handle money the way you tell them to deserve to be robbed by the police. Thank you for your great insight into how things should work by your view. Also, your anecdotal stories about how you think people feel about money are fantastic insights onto society and the nature of money. (end sarcasm)

      It is funny to me to see how what seems to be an avowed state worshiper will go through as many mental contortions as possible to justify theft and murder as long as it is done by a costumed government goons.

      Yes, sir, as you say, victims of crime are always at fault for being victims, of course, that is the answer to all of our crime problems!

      • “avowed state worshiper”

        Oh, yeah. Anybody here can tell you that’s me, to a ‘T’. Apparently, what has your little pink panties in a wad is your poor reading comprehension skills and the fact that you’ve just landed here. You don’t know who’s who on this site yet. Until you do, you need to do a little catch up reading. Good luck, and welcome to the discussion.

    • Law enforcement for profit is the controlling factor in all departments since the federal grant program was put into effect in the mid 70’s with the “drug war”. As the blue street gang becomes more brazen in abusing citizens and prosecutors have a new pipeline of cash that equates to enhanced power this will no longer be an unusual occurrence. The next time you see a police state check point know that all of the blue street gang members there have their advancement and compensation tied to the number of citations they write. It is sickening to realize that we, the law abiding motoring public, are their primary food source. Be ware and be aware.

  13. And people wonder why Bitcoin has value to some people. Call buyer, confirm he’ll accept bitcoin and set the price, travel to location, check out car, agree to buy it… transfer bitcoins, wait 10 minutes while it flows from your wallet to his wallet… drive off with new vehicle.

    If you get pulled over on the way, all you have is your cell phone… even if that gets confiscated, your BTC still aren’t at risk as long as you have taken appropriate cautions on security.

    Screw using FRN’s if you don’t have to, this story confirms that the government considers these pieces of paper their property and us mundanes are merely borrowing them.

    • Yes. This is the one use of bitcoin that I find myself coming back to over and over again. The fact that you can transfer it virtually with no risk of physical confiscation. People say it doesn’t have “inherent value”, while its true it has no physical inherent value, its inherent value is in the form that you can hide your money and make transactions anonymously without having to physically use anything that can be confiscated. I have never used bitcoin but I like having it around in case I need it.

    • Yep, assuming they even know you have some, Bitcoin cannot be confiscated without your consent because, presumably, only you know the keys or have access to them. Of course they can still “rubber hose them out of you.” But that’s a big difference from simply contacting the bank and “turning you off” or grabbing your cash whether you like it or not. If you use a “brain wallet” (this is a program that deterministically generates keys from a pass phrase you keep in your head) you don’t even have to carry anything and can regenerate your keys from any computer anywhere in the world.

    • You missed the point. Who are they to say that one cannot use LEGAL TENDER in a transaction, and who are they to TAKE the money even when one can provide proof ON THE SPOT of intent???

      Sure bitcoin is convenient as in interact or a bank note. NOT THE POINT. Possession of legal tender does not make one a criminal and it’s up to THEM to prove criminal intent.

      for example, buddy carries cash to but a car. Cops stop him and don’t believe him. He calls the person to talk to the cop to verify the sale, and even invites the cop to JOIN him as he drives to pick up the car. What possible justification does the cop have now to take the money? He COULD say “Oh that amount of money is clearly stolen or you’d use a bank transfer”, but without a single shred of proof, how CAN he say that? Or for that matter can he now say the money in your bank account is large and thus proof of criminal activity? Same logic after all…

      • They are the ones with the monopoly on legal violence.

        They aren’t going to bother going along to see if the story is true. They don’t care if it’s true. They are thieves, thugs, criminals. It’s a shakedown. The ‘illegal activity’ and the rest is just window dressing for the clovers and the unknowing masses who are bamboozled.

        They are highwaymen. They are members of the street gang that controls this turf. They’ll do as they please so long as the masses don’t rise up against them.

        • BrentP, exactly. The last thing they want to hear is YOU. They already know what they’re gonna do and it has nothing to do with what is really going on with you… asking the monkey to give up his banana


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