It Was Only 11 Years Ago

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You can get a sense of things by comparing things. It’s a way to objectively quantify whether you have more – or less. Which is a measure of whether things have gotten better – or worse.

In 2011 – only a dozen years ago, though it feels like an epoch – it was possible to not spend more than about $29k on a six-passenger, full-size, rear-wheel-drive family sedan with a standard V8 engine and a 20.6 cubic foot trunk. This was the Ford Crown Victoria – and it was the last full-sized family car with a standard V8 (and body-on-frame construction) that wasn’t a luxury-priced car.

Today, a similar car such as the 2023 BMW 7 Series sedan costs $93,300 – and for that you get a car about the same size as the Crown Victoria – both are 212 inches long – but without a standard V8 engine. The BMW comes standard with a much smaller 3.0 liter six cylinder engine vs. the Ford’s standard 4.6 liter V8 engine.

It’s true the BMW’s six makes more power than the Ford’s V8 but that misses the point – which is that it was only a dozen years ago that average Americans could afford a V8-powered full-size family car that seated six in comfort whereas today only a few very affluent people can afford to buy a nearly-six-figure full-sized luxury car that doesn’t come standard with a V8.

People forget that it was common – only a little more than ten years ago – for family-priced cars like the Vic to have them. And it was expected when you spent nearly $100k on a luxury-priced car such as a BMW 7 or similar, such as a Mercedes S-Class, Lexus LS or Audi A8.

Some of the latter were available with V12s.

Today, a V8 is optional – in some of these luxury cars.

And no one is selling a six-passenger, rear-wheel-drive family car with a standard V8 today for about $40k – which is what the $29,905 base price of the 2011 Crown Vic works out to, today.

It is true the Vic did not have a massive LCD touchscreen built into its dash, as new six figure full-sized luxury cars do. But it is also true that almost every other new car – including cars that cost a great deal less than the Vic did when it was new – also come standard with LCD touchscreens. And most of the other things that were once considered luxury-car things, such as climate control AC, very good stereos, full-roof sunroofs – and so on.

In other words, such things have become or are becoming common things. The person who pays six figures is paying more to get what others who pay a lot less also get.

But that only goes as far as amenities – and gimmicks.

For example, many of the newest luxury-priced cars can be voice-commanded to do things simply done by hand, such as turn up or down the volume of the stereo, or change the station – which has become harder to do in many of today’s six figure cars because you can’t do it by hand anymore. You are expected to tap/swipe the LCD touchscreen – which isn’t easy to do while driving, at least not without diverting your attention from driving.

There are also “soft close” doors that cinch themselves tight – because it is apparently laborious to close the door by hand. Things like this increasingly differentiate the six figure car from the family-priced car.

But the real point of difference is just that.

There no longer are family-priced, full-sized, six passenger, rear-drive cars such as the Crown Victoria and others like it (they once abounded). The closest you can get to something like it is the current Dodge Charger, which is a very nice car – but also a smaller (mid-sized, five-passenger) car. It is 198.4 inches long (a 2011 Vic is more than a foot longer) and it comes standard with a V6 and only has 16.4 cubic feet of space in its trunk.

The good news is it costs about $7k less to start (in inflation-adjusted/depreciated buying-power U.S. dollars) than the last Vic listed for when it was new. The bad news is that the Charger isn’t a full-sized, six-passenger car with a full-sized car’s trunk – and so is much less viable as a family car than the Vic was.

It is also being shoved off the market – just like the Vic was – and not because the market wasn’t (or isn’t) interested. The V8 Vic had to go because its V8 used too much gas for the government’s tastes.

Or rather, its regulations.

“Compliance costs” would have pushed the price of the Vic into luxury car territory – just as they have pushed V8s out of the engine bays of today’s full-size luxury cars, all of which come standard with sixes, notwithstanding their luxury car prices.

Dodge was able to continue building the Charger (and its siblings, the Challenger and Chrysler 300 ) for many years after the Vic was forced off the market – because their standard sixes were more to the government’s liking. But the government doesn’t like them as much anymore – sixes having become as mass-market compliant-impossible these days as V8s were back in those days (2011) and that is why all three of these are being pushed off the market, too.

This leaves most families looking at a much smaller (and much smaller-engined) front-wheel drive (maybe AWD) crossover, which is about what they can buy today for around $40k.

As contrasted with what $40k used to buy.

. . .

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  1. Still trying to get the door locks fixed on my 2007 Designer Town Car.

    Water leaked into the driver’s door via the side mirror and corroded the wiring harness enough to blow out the computer module (DDM) that controls the door locks. Neither are available from Ford…have to find them used & the DDM must be programmed for the specific trim-line & any options.

    My independent mechanic is still trying to fix the above problem, been a couple of weeks now.

    Looks great, hate to have to get rid of it.

  2. Back in the early 2000s, I used to drive part time for a local limo service to pick up some extra money. The guy had a couple of Lincoln stretches and a Mercury Grand Marquis, the mechanical twin of the Ford Crown Victoria. Man, that was a NICE car to drive! I used to have fun in that car. While it didn’t have tight, Euro style handling, the handling and steering were very secure and competent; it didn’t handle like the Detroit luxo barges of yore. The 4.6L V8 was GREAT! It could take off gently, or it could also get you going quickly, like when pulling from a parking garage onto a busy, NYC street-something I did a time or two. That car had a CAVERNOUS trunk-wow! I never had problems stowing the passengers’ luggage in there; even when I brought a couple to JFK for their vacation, I was easily able to fit all their bags in the trunk. The cockpit was nicely laid out for the driver; it was very user friendly, very intuitive, allowing you to do what you needed to do without taking your eyes off the road. I LOVED THAT CAR!

    It’s sad that it’s no longer being made. If it were still available, it would sell, big time! The car offered the best of the old and new; it had tech where it made sense, while it still offered good, old fashioned body-on-frame construction. Those cars held up too; it was common for those things to do multiple laps on the odometer. The one I drove had over 300K on the clock, yet it didn’t feel or perform like it. Then again, my boss looked after his cars. But yeah, taxi companies, limo services, and police departments LOVED this car! Ordinary people did too. The Ford Crown Victoria and Mercury Grand Marquis offered a lot of good, old fashioned value for the money. If Ford were to restart production on this car tomorrow, they’d sell out almost IMMEDIATELY! It’s a shame that they’re no longer being made. And they didn’t go out of production for lack of demand, either. That’s the travesty in all this…

    • I have pictures of what would have probably been a 2020 Crown Vic rolling down a street in Chicago in March 2019, shrouded, but there isn’t any mistaking that silhouette.

      Sadly, not long after that day, Impeachment proceedings for the Orange Man began and any rumors about the new vehicle promptly stopped. Ford probably realized that 50 MPG CAFE was inevitable and gave up on the car, something which, apparently, the cops were asking to see back on the road once the visibility problems in the Explorer-based police cruisers were becoming hard to ignore.

  3. I bought a used 1984 Crown Victoria for a sum of money, thought I made a good buy, but it was a dog. The engine was all carbon-ed up and black smoke poured out of the tail pipe every time you started it.

    It got hailed on, settled for the insurance claim, should have sold it for damages, then a cracked windshield, somebody offered 500 dollars. Just have to sell it for next to nothing, has to go.

    They didn’t care what it was, they needed transportation.

    Wish I had done some more detective work on the condition of the car.

    It was a nice car, melted down, it is definitely another new car by now. Whatever they are.

    It’s the Communists in DC, we know that for a fact, causing all of the sturm and drang!

    So there! Harumph!

    Go to the World Socialist Web Site dot org and get the real stories. Yeah, sure.

    The Onion is better, go there.

  4. The Crown Vic was a living fossil from the late 1970s and the last of its kind. It was ultimately killed because the expense for meeting the next round of regulations was not economically viable for the ancient platform or for making a new one.

    If the Vic had a redesign like a normal product cycle it probably would have cost more. But the tooling long paid off except for styling updates and such along with a shared engine made the car very affordable.

  5. The electronics and screens don’t cost much. You can get a 7″ tablet for less than $100 retail these days. Most of the sensors are pretty standard components like thermistors, pressure and contact sensors. Really basic electronics even when bus controller chips are added. Most of these systems are running WindRiver VxWorks or Android and get all their data from the CANBUS.

    But the markup is incredible, even more when you start to add on skins and software options.

  6. I almost cried when I gave my Vic away after driving it for close to 20 years but a $1200 exhaust repair on a car that needed new fenders, quarters, wheel wells and a partial floor pan struck me as a poor investment. On the bright side it got turned into a dirt track car and is still around 5 years later so that’s good. In a couple hundred thousand miles I never had a drive train problem and even at 50 below (plugged in/ battery warmer) it would always start. Still miss it but I’ve got too many vehicles to get another one.

    When I bought it as a low mileage used car from the local Ford dealer the sales manager said I was the youngest person he ever seen buy one for a personal use vehicle.

    • The Crown Vic was designed to be serviced by morons and still run 400,000 miles just by changing the oil and watching the coolant level.

      My father, a Ford lifer, told me 30 years ago that Ford would be finished the moment they stopped producing the Crown Vic for the cops and limo services. He may yet be proven right.

  7. An illegitimate fake government controlling what cars you can drive….

    Once you understand that you are just a tax slave and a debt slave in a debt slave farm billed as ‘a free country with elected government’ (actually a for profit corporation that calls itself government, so it has an excuse to steal taxes from slaves)….but really with the sole purpose to provide maximum rent to the real owners of the place….the luciferion aristocracy…. while keeping the slaves scared and quiet, it all comes into it’s place.

    All the utter BS, ideological indoctrination, fear, confusion, regulations suddenly start making perfect sense.

  8. Great commentary on the Crown Vic. I would also like to add that it got very, very good gas mileage for a full-sized V-8 — I think around 24-25 on the highway. Also it is noteworthy that it was only 12 years ago you could still buy a truly small body-on-frame truck like a Ranger or Dakota.

    The changes that have happened in the last 10-12 years in the U.S. — not just the auto industry — are very profound and occurring at a dizzying pace that is difficult to keep up with. The re-election of Obama was a palpable turning point. It was clear that he was not a fluke, that the people really wanted this guy (not that Romney was any kind of real alternative). Obama’s strategy was to relentlessly hammer the people on left-wing ideological issues, from anti-white racial bias to “climate change” to homosexuality and feminism to wokeness in the military and on and on. The cadre of Deep Staters who infested Washington during his eight years have become an permanent ideological vanguard.

    I also noticed that the new generation of young people circa 2010-2012 were very different than kids in the past, namely they were far more obsessed with their electronic devices and their cell phones, very entitled and sheltered, very ideological, and very difficult to engage with and converse with than youth of the past.

    I am an early Gen Xer so while I am hardly young I am not truly “old” yet, but the past 10-12 years has made me feel a lot older than I should and has made me feel like an alien in my own country. 10-12 years ago I thought we could still turn this ship around if we organized and got the right candidates in office… now I think the country is a Lost Cause.

    • Hi X,

      In re:

      “I am an early Gen Xer so while I am hardly young I am not truly “old” yet, but the past 10-12 years has made me feel a lot older than I should and has made me feel like an alien in my own country.”

      Me too. The only thing that gives me some hope is that there are kids who aren’t like the ones you described. Almost all of them – that I know – are home schooled kids.

      No correlation there.

      • We should have a little hope. More and more kids are being homeschooled. I can’t count how many people have come to me for advice on how to get started on homeschooling, classes, curriculum, social events, etc.

        There is a grass roots movement taking place; it is just slow going. Parents pulling their kids out of indoctrination camps have continually increased since COVID. Many parents are now taking a look at what the public schools (even private schools) are teaching, the crime, the bullying, etc. and have decided “not my kid.”

        It is refreshing to see and I only hope that the movement continues to grow.

        • Thank you!
          I couldn’t have said it better myself.
          The COVID “plandemic” opened up a lot of parents eyes whose children were being “distance learning”. Parents finally were able to observe the indoctrination (brainwashing) taking place in their childrens’ “education”.
          Best regards,

        • The retort from gov school believers “they need socialization!”

          Right. With thugs, druggies, gang members- no, they can socialize with other normal kids via clubs and meetups with other home schoolers. Grandson did a hybrid program last year at home except for three days a week science and shop class 8th grade. Back to either full online or private school next fall.

          I married a Seattle girl, poor thing was a white survivor of Rainer Beach High. Learned nothing in 4 years except survive, this was 50 years ago. Dad was too cheap to pay for a out of district school. Her best friend ended up transferred after the sister got beat up by a group of diversity bus-in’s.

      • My nephews give me hope, as do the neighbor kids. They seem to know what’s going on. Well the older nephew does, younger maybe not, but at least he like girls… and he is smart enough to get invited into the elites’ circle so I’m sure he’ll be fine even if he gets dippy.

      • I am a very early Gen Xer too, and sometimes I wish I was a lot older with the way things are fast tracking right down into hell. I try to be positive about the future. But when you have a US Supreme Court Justice that cannot give the definition of a woman, and when you have to warn people to look up from their damned phones before they step out into traffic (they apparently never played Frogger as a kid), I have to wonder…

        • Indeed, Shadow –

          Gen X and older can vividly recall America, that place which no longer exists. It was a remarkably free place – relative to what exists now. Perhaps the most startling metric of this transition is the truly Soviet-esque micromanaging of our personal lives that we deal with today that was largely absent in the America of our childhood and youth. There were no “checkpoints.” You could smoke (I don’t but that’s beside the point) almost anywhere. Even in high school. We had a “smoking arcade” at mine. Jump on a flight at the last minute with a ticket you bought using cash. No one was forced to buy “health insurance.” It was available if you wanted it. Kids routinely wandered around the neighborhood on their bicycles, staying out until the sun went down and it was time to come home for supper.

          So many small things that added up to big ones.

          • “ Soviet-esque micromanaging of our personal lives that we deal with today that was largely absent in the America of our childhood and youth “

            Even the Soviet of Washington State was easy peasy up into the ‘80s. Open container law hadn’t been implemented so for “boys night out “ after work, we had a cooler full of beer in the back seat and I chauffeured in my hand me down ‘66 Olds. The vanpool was fun as well, Fridays were “happy hour for the hour ride home”. White wine for the ladies, bottle of vodka and mixers for all, beer if you like. 12 happy riders getting a head start in the weekend!

            No wonder so many are uptight these days, restrict restrict restrict.

    • X,

      I forgot to put that in my above post-DAMN! But yeah, I used to drive a Mercury Grand Marquis, the mechanical twin to the Crown Vic, and I could pull low-mid 20s mpg out of that car routinely. My boss was always happy when he saw the miles left to drive when I refueled the car; he could see that I’d driven it gently.

  9. My ‘14 F-150 STX MSRP was around $41K. Now that same packaged truck 4×4 5.0 engine; around $54K. After 10 years, what was doable in now getting to be unaffordable. Hell, a mid trim level XLT is in the mid $60’s. A Lariat or higher, forget about it! As far as a used Crown Vic is concerned, if I run across one with low miles and well cared for, I’m buying it. You’ll never lose money on those types of autos.

  10. Everything these days automotive is sad. Boring 2.0 liter turbo motors with no character. Blob crossovers are everywhere. The Vic wasn’t a great car, but it had a V-8, was rock-solid reliable and comfortable to boot. Wish I had one.

    Speaking of RWD, the order books close for the Dodge Charger at the end of the month.

    Dodge’s idiot CEO says “As we transition to an exciting, electrified muscle car future…”

    There’s nothing exciting about range anxiety, sitting and waiting for a rapid charging station that kills your battery life, that horrific “engine noise” that Dodge engineers think will replace a V-8 rumble, fake shifting and paying twice as much for a vehicle that is inferior in nearly all measures to an ICE economy car. Piss off, you corporate lackey whore.

    As for the Biden Regime, we’re going to be in a world of hurt if there is an oil supply issue since we’ve drained the Strategic Petroleum Reserve to its lowest level in decades. I think it’s by design because those satanic bastards believe that if an incident cuts the oil tap, it will increase the EV “transition.”

    • Hi Dr!

      I think the Vic was a great car – we just didn’t appreciate it at the time. Full-sized, full-frame; rear drive and a V8. At about the same price point that – today – buys you an AWD crossover with a 2.0 liter turbo four.

      As far as Dodge: An “electrified muscle car” is an absurdity. It is like a steak made out of compressed crickets. Muscle cars have V8s. Period. Without one, it’s just another car. Maybe a performance car. But – again – that is not the same thing as a muscle car.

      • 2011 was a bad year for Ford. It was the last year for their only two good vehicles. The Crown Vic and the Ranger.

          • Chrysler cars are junk….Mr. Potato cars: same tuber just change the nose, ears, mouth, eyes, shoes, etc. Same junk. Lowest resale, brand allegiance, and dependability.

            • Hi Fritz,

              This was said of Mopars back in the day – and maybe there was some truth to it. But Dodge and Chrysler and Plymouth cars were often at the lead when it came to styling and few made by others had balls as big! The Last Call Challengers are true to that worthy tradition.

              • And their performance. They pretty much owned racing, NASCAR and drag racing in the late 60s.
                In that same era, they also built VERY reliable and durable cars.
                And then came FedGov.

              • I grew up on the east side of Detroit back in the day, Chrysler factories everywhere. Everyone’s dad worked there or for a supplier.

                Cool story: a friends big brother came home from his hitch in Nam, and his dad had a big yellow ‘69 Coronet Super Bee in the driveway waiting for him. I still remember the smile on that guys face. What a great looking car! I thought the bee decal was the coolest thing I had ever seen.

                • Amen, Krusty!

                  A high school pal of mine (this in the ’80s) managed to buy a ’71 GTX 440 (single four barrel). It was the first car I ever drove that barked the tires on the -12 upshift (Torqueflite auto with Slapstick). What a glorious – ominous – rig that thing was!

      • Yuck, that is like a bottle blonde or fake tits. Or a body builder man that is all bulk but no brawn. No thanks. To all of the above and the EV too.

      • Eric,

        I agree! See my above post for my memories of driving the Mercury Grand Marquis, the mechanical twin of the Ford Crown Victoria. That car made work fun!

    • ‘As for the Biden Regime, we’re going to be in a world of hurt if there is an oil supply issue since we’ve drained the Strategic Petroleum Reserve to its lowest level in decades.’ — dr_mantin_toboggan_md

      Actually one person — an idiot bitch named Jennifer Granholm — drained those oil caverns. Under whose direction, we don’t know.

      She should be impeached, of course. However, worse malefactors such as Alejandro Mayorkas and Merrick Beria Garland are at the head of the queue for censure.

      But members of Clowngress have higher priorities. Today they will deliver abject standing ovations for their real president — one Isaac Herzog — as he addresses a joint session. Yesterday the House passed this resolution 412-9 as a welcoming gesture:

      Makes ya proud, don’t it? /sarc

      Now bend over …

      • Agree wholeheartedly Jim,
        Every member of Clowngress/government should be impeached and prosecuted for treason for putting the interests of a foreign nation ahead of their own. It does reveal where their true allegiance is; hat tip to the few who will boycott that session.

        • Let’s start with “shalom” DeSantis who signed two bills which affect Floridians while in israel.
          One of the bills (HB-269) enshrines “holocaustianity” as a “state religion” and criminalizes anyone who criticizes said “religion”. This bill also mandates that ALL Florida school children will attend services at “holocaustianity temples” (also known as “holocaust museums”.
          Anyone who does business with the state of Florida must sign a contract which includes an agreement not to participate in any BDS (Boycott Divestment Sanctions) movement against israel.
          Since when do matters concerning israel have any official bearing on AMERICAN citizens?

        • Hi Mike
          Can’t believe I’m aligning myself with “the Squad”, but they’re the only ones who got it right with this Israel bullshit

          • Hi Floriduh,

            I consider myself a Live and Let Live kind of girl, but I could not understand the Republican nominees (Pence, DeSantis, and Haley’s) stand for Israel at last week’s Family Leader event hosted by The Blaze. Why would this even be said? Are they running for President of the US or President of Israel? It struck me as almost rehearsed or forced.

            I do thank Tucker Carlson though for single handily ending the Presidential campaigns of Pence and Hutchinson. 🙂

              • Hi Mister,

                Tim Scott didn’t come off looking much better, but he is a likable guy so I don’t think it will affect him too much.

                I think the real winner of the debate was Tucker. He was tough on the candidates, but fair. I also applaud him for admitting to not taking the clot shot. Something that Hutchinson refused to answer. My guess is most politicians didn’t take the shot, but will not acknowledge it out loud for fear their constituents will flog them in the Town Square.

                • Flogging in them in the town square is a suspended sentence in my opinion. By Asa Hutchinson’s looks, I don’t think he did. I’m not sure that Zombie Pence did either. I am pretty sure Trump got stuck with the needle.

                  • Yeah. I agree. Tim Scott is a moron. Sorry. Nikki Haley doesn’t know the difference between mail in ballots and mail out ballots. Something is in the South Carolina drinking water. Rammie is impressive except when you look at his tweet supporting masks. He’s fake, too.

                    • I really want to like Vivek. He is the smartest of the bunch and actually has solutions, but I have this nagging feeling that he is secretly Benedict Arnold. Maybe it is his credentials as a pharmaceutical CEO, but I am apprehensive.

                      Nikki is a blazing neocon.

                      If I hear one more candidate “stand with Ukraine” I am going to vomit. I just have a problem sending my children and other people’s children into war.

                    • Hi RG,

                      “If I hear one more candidate “stand with Ukraine” I am going to vomit. ”

                      Amen! I wore my Keeeeeeeeeeeeeeev shirt today while doing David Knight’s show.

        • I agree with Mike in Beantown, which begs this question. One of the biggest mistakes the founders made — arguably their most egregious — was their failure to set up a system of recall to allow voters to easily, quickly, and immediately throw the bums out. . .without having to wait for the next election cycle of course. That oversight has been a complete disaster. So how should they have done this?

          Now I know what you’re thinking and no, it should not be the childishly simple process of requiring a majority of voters needed to exercise the recall option. A small minority should be able to pull it off armed with adequate proof the intended (crook) target has violated his oath to the constitution based on the severity of the violation or perhaps the number of times he/she has violated it.

          Of course it’s not to say it would be a perfect system and bring us utopia. But what a vast improvement it would have been to the ordinary folk’s standard of living. Compare that to the alternative of having to wait (it always seems like forever — naturally up to 6 years in the case of a u.s. senator) to correct the mistake the majority made on election day. Isn’t it obvious that even a lame duck politician with his remaining tenure can practically do or say anything armed with the knowledge that he’s cemented in office until the next election? How gullible and naive can anyone be to not realize the enormous damage someone in that position of great political power can do over a period of years before they can be tossed out?

          Anyone up for the 28th Amendment to the BOR? Of course a 2 year term limit (including govt employees — with few exceptions) should be established at the get-go.

          • The 17th amendment made this worse. The States were supposed to rule the roost and the US Senate was their power / voice at the Fed level. State legislators were in charge of selection of senators, now just another popularity contest. Get rid of the 17th, allow the senate to recall federal officials via “no confidence vote”, get going on whatever amendment (s) need to be passed to get the States back in charge.

            ‘Course the rabble these days only hear “democracy” not “representative republic”. Now we’re over run with imported folk that do not and probably never will understand the importance of adhering to the constitutional representative republic ideal.

      • The SPR is the least of the problems created by O’Biden’s reign of terror. By villifying oil and gas, and fracking specifically, the investment in domestic oil production has plateaued. Whatever’s producing now is pretty much it until someone who’s not beholden to the energy traders gets into office. And governments everywhere (in the “free world”) are looking to ban oil before 2030 or so anyway so no new fields will be developed. Short term thinking and long term worry.

        Most people really can’t grasp just how revolutionary the fracking revolution has been. Fields that were thought dry came roaring back, and much better too, as the secret sauce of fracking fluids and tightly controlled pressure maintained flow out of the fissures instead of allowing them to collapse. The real price of domestic oil plummeted while CAFE standards went up (which meant more miles driven, not reduction of demand -which is always what happens with efficieny gains). So what’s a futures market to do? Restrict supply across the board. Only government has that kind of broad regulatory authority so they put their guys in. And you’re paying $4 for gasoline at the pump.

  11. That’s what a comfortable car interior was, look at those seats! No center console or pod to knock your knees on, seats you sit -in- instead of half your leg hanging over the bolster. For long trips you cannot beat a cruiser like that. Plus the quiet, body on frame rules for quiet interiors.

    The later model years got decent mileage, neighbors full size Buick would do better than 21MPG on trips. Hell even my overweight ‘05 Gran Cherokee did 20 or better at 75, especially on non alky real gasoline.

    • “That’s what a comfortable car interior was, look at those seats! No center console or pod to knock your knees on, seats you sit -in- instead of half your leg hanging over the bolster. For long trips you cannot beat a cruiser like that. Plus the quiet, body on frame rules for quiet interiors.”

      This is exactly what I’m interested in. Looking for the most comfortable car for me. I’ve never sat in one of these Panthers, nor a Buick Lesabre, Century, or Park Ave. I have sat in a Town and Country and Sienna that were very comfortable. Interested in hearing other suggestions.

      • Hi Brandon,

        I have been fortunate enough to drive many of these big American cars and I can vouch from personal experience there is nothing like them except for high-collar luxury cars and even they aren’t as soft and comfortable as the old dreadnoughts were. Of course, they don’t “handle” that well.

        Who cares? That’s like worrying about how many calories are in that cheeseburger you’re eating.

        • I wish you hadn’ta wrote this article. I’ve been googling Crown Victoria’s and Marquis for the last few days now. Most are pretty beat up but there’s still some in good shape. I could not find a good Crown Victoria for miles around me. There is a dealer in Cincinnati with a bunch of ex-police cruisers for sale. I might have to make a trip.

          • I don’t know how you guys can even consider a cop car, Blues Brothers aside.

            This whole thread I’ve thought often of my Dad’s ’79 Pontiac Bonneville

            Rear ended & totaled on the West Coast. I miss that boat.

            …And, my buddy’s ’70’s seventh gen Lincoln Thunderbird.

            No bad vibes to those rides.

          • I hear you, Krusty –

            It’s how I felt about others who wrote (in a negative cast) about the license plate “loophole” available in Vermont. We may go to a local car museum today today to check out what we used to be allowed to buy….

        • “Who cares? That’s like worrying about how many calories are in that cheeseburger you’re eating.”

          Indeed Eric, my sentiments exactly. I let the automotive press convince me I wanted a “good handling” car when I was young. What an idiot I was. Now I make my own preferences, like not being in pain while sitting in the damn car. Comfort is a function of health.

  12. People buy these because they can get financing. How much will the price change as interest rates rise? I can’t even calculate what the $6T of convid money has done to distort prices.

    And what are people giving up to afford the expense of current vehicles? Retirement savings seems to be one.

    • A friend of mine dipped into her retirement to fix her car, rather than saddle herself with car payments for 5 to 7 years.
      She is 65 and is seeing her retirement account rapidly dwindle. I told her to use the money wisely such as using some of it to fix her car that will last her a lot longer….etc because one day the money will either be worthless, or the Feds will steal it.

  13. Ford came very close to introducing a new Crown Vic to make the cops happy. I even have photos of a shrouded test car I spotted on the street in Chicago in March of 2019.

    There is no mistaking that silhouette.

    The plans seemed to go away when Impeachment started rolling and the manufacturers realized Trump was not getting a second term.

  14. The Crown Victoria and Grand Marquis were a lot of car for the money. They looked slow, but could do 0 to 60 in eight seconds. Great cars for long trips — only a Lincoln Town Car was better that I had experience with.

    But they had a few problems too: Too big for easy parking, and sometimes too wide for garages in older homes.

    The third problem was only for Ford management employees: They never offered us a discounted lease price. Ford would only offer good lease deals on cars and trucks not selling well, like the Lincoln Continental.

    Crown Victoria, Grand Marquis and Lincoln Town Cars made significant profits for Ford. Not as much as the F150 and Large SUVs, but more than Mustangs, and especially more than all other carlines in the past, when Ford sold lots of car models.

    I talked to a recently retired Ford engineer about why Ford chose the F150 and Mustang as their early EVs for the general public. The product planners decided the F150 was the best selling vehicle in the US, so that seemed to be the best truck for an EV. And Mustang was the only Ford carline — the fast EV acceleration seemed appropriate for a Mustang, not that the Mustang EV looks anything like an ICE Mustang.

    “Why are Ford EV sales so poor”, I asked: The answer I got is: ‘They cost a lot more than ICEs, but are worth less to customers.’

    • Hi Richard,

      The Vic is about the same length as a current full-sized SUV such as the Expedition and – in my opinion – less unwieldy to deal with because it’s not as obnoxiously tall and had much better all-around visibility. Old people used to regularly drive Vics (and the Grand Marquis).

      • The Crown Victoria was 211 inches long and 77.5 inches wide.
        The Ford Expedition is 79.9 inches wide and 210 inches wide.

        Both too big for my 1955-era garage unless folding the mirrors to go in and out. That’s a pain with the Crown Victoria’s hard to fold manually side mirrors.

        As a teenager, I was chased by a New York State Police Crown Victoria after zooming past a radar trap. I escaped down some back roads that I knew from bicycle riding as a child. I recall that big old Crown Vic. accelerated from 0 to 60 a lot faster than I expected, but never got close enough to read my license plate.

        A friend’s parents had a Lincoln Town Car and a Mercury Marquis. They always had trouble fitting both cars in their two-car garage. They managed to break a few side view mirrors over the years.

  15. Every time I saw a Crown Vic, my knee jerk reaction was “shit it’s the cops”.

    Guessing the po-po preferred it because it was 4000 lbs of American steel, balsy motor, and roomy enough for all the gear required of a modern AGW.

    • Hi Mike,

      Cops also liked them because they are very comfortable places to spend a lot of time in. The Charger cop cars barely have enough room for the perp’s legs!

  16. Just in case you didn’t know the government hates your guts for wanting what they don’t want you to have. All the while punishing you for saving with inflation, themselves going 32 trillion in debt, and of course traveling around the world meeting new and interesting people and then blowing their brains out. Of course the latter isn’t working out too well, so they will probably just stay home and blow our brains out.
    They are after all socio/psychopaths.

    • Hey John.
      I LMAO whenever I see a article about saving for retirement while they inflate away what’s left of the dollars buying power. I saved for my retirement,,, the money now buys a quarter of what it did when I put it in savings. It’s just another scam to extract what little wealth you managed to hang on to. Savings don’t mean squat when inflation is rampant. You think it’s a ripoff now? Wait until they implement the CBDC. What they are doing today is child’s play compared to that. But I personally believe Americans will swallow that load as well.

      Wars are more fun and profitable for them. Notice their kiddies don’t ‘serve’ and die for our freedumbs. That’s because they’re part of the parasite class. And as parasites,,, everything they do is related to bleeding the proles as much as possible.

      From the book 1984:
      But, as Julia notes in Part 1, Chapter 5, the enemy is not really significant: “It’s always one bloody war after another, and one knows the news is all lies anyway” In other words, it’s not the enemy who matters but rather the fact that Oceania is constantly at war. Whether the war is even happening is another non-issue: again, it is the fact that the party maintains a constant state of war that is truly significant.

      Who is Oceania battling? Is there even a war? Is the war real or just another depopulating event.

      • Ken wrote: Notice their kiddies don’t ‘serve’ and die for our freedumbs.

        O’Biden’s good kid served, got killed by friendly (chemical) fire and became a campaign talking point. The ass in chief wouldn’t shut up about it until the polling data came back and they found out no one gave a shit about Beau, and the subject drew attention to Hunter.

        Don’t let a crisis go to waste!


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