Well, the other shoes has dropped. We now know how a “market” for electric cars will be created.
It will be done by outlawing the market for cars that aren’t electric.
Having trouble selling Tab?
Forbid the sale of Coke and Pepsi!
California Governor (and Gesundheitsfuhrer) Gavin Newsome has simply decreed – via “executive order” – that anything that isn’t “zero emissions” (at the tailpipe) must be “phased out” by 2035. This means only electric cars since they are the only vehicles considered to be “zero “emissions” by the regs – no matter their elsewhere emissions – including the substantial carbon dioxide “emissions” produced by the utility plants that generate the electricity they run on. 
Which there will be more of when the only cars permitted on California roads are electric. But never mind. It feels good – to the Gesundheitsguv – like the wearing of any old rag to “stop the spread” of a virus you haven’t got.
The effects will also be felt a lot sooner than fifteen years from now.
And not just in California, either.
The car companies are going to stop putting R&D money toward cars they can’t sell in California – the biggest market for cars in the country – and toward the ones they’ll be forced to sell.
In other states, too. Because it’s likely at least some will follow California’s lead – having their own Gesundheitsguvs in charge.
Development of new non-electric cars nationally will stagnate.
The ones that remain in production will sell for more, to offset the costs of developing electric cars. The more states that force-electrify, the more expensive the non-electric car will become – until the goal is achieved of making the non-electric car at least as expensive as electric cars.
At which point they become “competitive” with non-electric cars.
To get a sense of what this is going to cost you, consider that the least expensive electric cars on the market right now are compacts like the Nissan Leaf and Chevy Bolt – which sticker in the low-mid $30k range.
About twice the cost of current non-electric compact car equivalents.
An electric SUV or truck will likely cost you $50-$70k to start – not counting the wait.
Sales of new, non-electric cars in California are apt to wane almost immediately and will probably collapse entirely within five years if Newsome’s decree stands – since why buy a car that will likely become worthless – because useless – by the time you’ve paid it off or want to trade it in?
Newsomites are also likely to double-whammy the non-electric car in CA before 2035 by applying heavy “polluter” taxes to existing non-electric cars and by restricting where they can be driven before or after then.
People are going to abandon ship long before we get to 2035.
And not just individual people, either.
This will include dealerships – many of whom cannot afford to “invest” in electric car “technology” – which is nothing new but very expensive. GM dealers are already being pressured to spend hundreds of thousands of dollars each on “technology” to support electric cars, such as “fast” charging facilities and so on. The problem for many of these dealerships, of course, is that it doesn’t pencil. The “investment” in “technology” won’t generate a profit – which is another way of saying it’s a loss. Which explains why they are being pressured – pressure not being necessary when there is a profit to be made.
This being the general problem with electric cars.
No one has made a cent selling them.
This includes Tesla, which has made a lot of money – just not by selling cars. It makes money by extorting it from those who don’t make electric cars, who are forced to buy “credits” from Tesla in lieu of making them, in order to meet their “zero emissions vehicle” production quota.
Which has just been increased by decree to encompass all production.
Now Tesla (and the others) will make money selling electric cars . . . by forcing people to buy nothing else.
They’ll also be buying more electricity – or rather paying more for it, since more capacity will needed to generate it, California’s grid being already at capacity. This will generate more carbon dioxide “emissions,” too… which brings us back ’round to the big lie that electric cars are “clean” – while non-electric cars aren’t.
Newsome’s decree rides on that lie and also corollary absurdities that depend on teeth-aching ignorance to bite down on. For example, Newsome’s claim in a Tweet (a thing appropriate to silly 12-year-old girls) that “cars shouldn’t give our kids asthma.”
How an inert gas – that’s carbon dioxide – which constitutes a literal sliver of the earth’s atmospheric gasses “gives our kids asthma” is of a piece with a dirty old bandana “stopping the spread” of a sickness the wearer hasn’t got.
And “our” kids, Herr Gesundheitsguv?
Don’t kids belong to their parents?
Idiocy aside, there is the lie that an inert gas issuing from the tailpipes of combustion-engined cars is causing a “climate crisis.”
Which is also a bait-and-switch – one made necessary because the pollution crisis (it was really more like a problem) was solved about thirty years ago, by which time the emissions from combustion-engined cars which created or contributed to problems such as smog and – here it comes – asthma – had been reduced to essentially nil and thus, their effect to negligible.
Almost never reported (like the fact that almost no one who isn’t very elderly or very sick is dying from WuFlu) but indisputably true is the fact that more than 97 percent of the modern combustion-engine emissions – the harmful ones that caused or contribute to smog, asthma and so on – were eliminated decades ago. 
If it were conceded that combustion-engined cars are in fact so clean that many of them qualify – under California standards, mind – as partial zero-emissions vehicles – then the excuse for the existence of a vast regulatory apparat and all the apparatchiks dissipates.
Hence the urgency to change the definition of “emissions” – to something else.
To carbon dioxide. It is of a piece with the bait-and-switch from “flattening the curve” to “stopping the spread” . . . and from the body count to the “case” count.
There is no longer a rational argument to be made against non-electric cars. Which is why an irrational one had to be invented. And used to pass a death sentence on non-electric cars, for offenses they didn’t commit.
Which brings us to real reason for the force-feeding of electric cars. 
It isn’t that they’re “clean.” It is that they are expensive. That’s not a problem. It’s a feature.
The point of all this.
EVs are much too expensive for non-Newsome Americans, who haven’t got the money the political-technocratic elite has. The political-technocratic elite is well-ware of this fact. The Newsomites know perfectly well that EVs will remain a sideshow attraction so long as ordinary people can buy something else.
Hence the importance of making sure they can’t.
EVs will render the privately owned automobile a thing of the past – except for the Newsomites, who can afford an EV. Just as they can afford their own private airplanes.
It’s not about “clean” air. Nor salving the breathing difficulties of asthmatic children. 
The Newsomites don’t want the non-Newsomites to buy cars, period.
When EVs are the only cars available, then only the Newsomites will be able to buy them.
The masses will be allowed to ride – or rent.
This has been the hidden goal of the technocratic elite for generations, going all the way back to the era prior to the introduction of the Model T Ford, which had the audacity of being so affordable anyone – egads! – could own one, whereas previously they had been the hand-built indulgences of the very wealthy and – as such – a vehicle of their privilege.
Not that there is anything wrong with being wealthy – or indulging.
The problem – the human failing – is when wealthy people resent the not-wealthy for enjoying similar privileges, which the wealthy (but not healthy in the head) regard as a diminution of their own.
. . .
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The last time I bought a bike it was $78 bucks total; out the door and pedal ( it away mode 10 speed ) modal. It lasted 8 years ( enduring all manner of ) abuses and neglecting as if I was a hatefilled racist orange skin Oompah Loompah Million Billion Air Conglomerated Big Orange Apple Super Celebrity super mogul.
T’is true it was blue. Varsity blues all through & through: so true & true. My schoolmates all rode Continental ( they got for Xmas, I bought my own ) The little lads laughed ( and said ) I must be retarded some special demented retard mental.
It perished in it’s final heroes’ “ghost riding” mission (OOH-RAH). It really was siempre fiel, semper fi. A stiff upper lip and never a tear came to eye as iit and a couple dozen of spinning soldiering bikes’ comrades rolled grimly down that final hill.
Into the breach like gleaming lemmings. (I had a huge garage full of them I had accepted ` lieu of rent. ) The looks on tenant faces in the ticky tacky suburban pennant races. There crashed a red (one) a green (one) a yellow and a black (one).
Their pride, their lies, all paid for with wacky taffy fiat ticky tack. I watched them crash and break. They were all worth (nothing) just the same. They laughed till red-eyed. They said no colors anymore. I want you to paint it shatters black. What does it mattered. They’re still spilling, you all over the place, MANHATTANED. Rats on every east sides. Bedbugs uptown. The curve’s been flattened, FlAtTeNeD FLATTENED!…what say… sha dah dah duh duh….
Tor,
Most fun I ever had was on a bike I found in the garbage in my 20’s (It probably cost someone $99 when new)….I put $25 into it, rehabilitating it- and rode it for a few years. There’s something to be said for something functional which cost virtually nothing and which you don’t have to care about. ‘Course…I only used to ride maybe 5 or 6 miles in those days….my opinion would probably be different had I had to ride it 35 or 50 miles…..
And then there was the single-speed Ross I had when I was around 10. NOTHING beats that! Cost my mother $59 brand new..and was the best bike EVER!
My gravel pit had been a destination for trespassers years before I bought the property. I’m trying to reclaim it, and have a 1980 Honda XR250 so I can run down there and chase them out. Problem is that the gas these days is so crappy that it requires a carb rebuild every Spring.
I just bought a Sur-Ron electric bike. $3,600. 125 pounds. This thing has the torque of the 250 and can climb any hill I’ve thrown at it. Plus, it’s so quiet that I can sneak up on the trespassers (Glock on my hip, of course) and convince them to leave.
You’re not gonna tear up the track all day with this thing, but it certainly suits my needs.
Hi Baxter,
It sounds fun – and quiet – which will be helpful dealing with the trespassers. How far does it go before it needs a recharge?
Hard to say. They say you get 70 miles out of a charge. It’s got a “Sport” mode, which increases the maximum speed from 20 to 50. When you’re running full out, the battery drains pretty quickly. The way I ride, I put it on the charger every couple weeks.
They import it as an electric bicycle for tariff purposes. But that means it can’t go faster then 20mph. All you need to do is cut the green/black wire and it opens it up to 50.
The battery pack is removable, so if you want to go all day, just get a couple extra packs and swap them out during the day.
Luna Cycles in San Diego is the importer. Definitely worth checking out.
Firstly, you’ve struck squarely the nail, with the postulate that the elites don’t want us to have personal cars. I believe it’s not only some kind of vendetta about the populace-at-large having access to their “privileges”, but it’s truly about limiting where you can go. An electric and automated Johnny-Cab might just refuse to take you to “unauthorized” locations.
Secondly, and this will arouse the ire of many here… I’m a scientist and have studied extensively the link between man-made emissions and the rise of global temperatures. From this, *gasp* I conclude much of the recent warming is due to increases in atmospheric CO2 concentrations. THAT SAID, the degree to which the temperature will rise per ppm increase in CO2, tipping-points and the effects of feedback loops, etc. haven’t been concretely established, in my opinion. HOW it will effect the climate in any one area is also a matter of contention.
Thirdly, I’m often so very alone, as I also believe in a free market. I’m about as laissez-faire as it gets. I don’t want mandates for helmets, seatbelts and especially not face-diapers. I oppose regulations for the myriad technical details in a car’s design, as I believe consumers will shape all of that by their wishes and dollars, and I believe it heavily and negatively impacts innovation. Or, perhaps I don’t want so much in the way of innovating, as I want to keep my 350-packing, 1990 Chevy just the way it is for the rest of my life.
Fourthly, I like electric cars IN PRINCIPLE, as it would be quite nice never again make so many maintenance purchases or perform so much of the maintenance I eschew every year. Must they REALLY cost so much to produce, I wonder? Perhaps it also has to do with “saaaaaffetyyyy”? From my rudimentary calculations, I think it’s possible to produce a decent EV to get you through the daily grind for ~$10,000. I’ve also enjoyed my electric bicycles. A 1000 watt hub motor will allow you to haul ass (35 MPH), and a $600 investment will give you a 30 mile range or so, and theoretically, ~10 years of life. Are EVs necessary, even if you’re shiveringly fearful of climate change?
Fifthly, No, EVs aren’t necessary. For over 100 years, chemists have been able to turn anything carbonaceous into useful hydrocarbons. The Fischer-Tropsch process has been well established, and used to make all of that wonderful synthetic oil you put in your car. It could also be used to turn biomass into gasoline and diesel. Yes, the same biomass that Kommiefornia has been watching go up in smoke (and the accompanying CO2, and all the other combustion products that “give” the children asthma). I believe it could be made economical and profitable by the proper entrepreneurs (and no gov’t fatwas). AND it would allow everyone to keep their cars AND it would be “carbon neutral”. In my neighborhood, right now, there are huge piles of people’s tree-trimmings and yard clippings piled up everywhere, just waiting to become fuel.
But, as always, ideas that make sense and that don’t require gov’t intervention go directly to the scrap heap of history.
And don’t get me started about the mega-s&%$-ton of useless, redundant, publish-or-perish, grant consuming energy research out there, when our energy systems could have been light years ahead of where we are now were it not for those in power and their iron grip on everything!
Okay, I’m done for now.
BaDnOn,
“I’ve also enjoyed my electric bicycles.” “…and a $600 investment will give you a 30 mile range or so…”
Any recommendations for makes and models? Thanks…
LibX,
Youtuber Louis Rossman has a modified electric bike which will do 30MPH and has a pretty good range…but I believe he has about $3K into it. I don’t think the $600 bikes are anywhere near as practical (Hell, you can’t even get a decent pedal-only bike for $600)
I’m too lazy to go through Rossman’s videos to find the one where he gives details about his bike…but vids showing him commuting on it, from Brooklyn to mid-town Manhattan are easy to find. If I had to live in NYC again (and were unsuccessful at offing myself!) I’d get one!
Yeah, I don’t know what the man you mention here made, but you have to build one and be resourceful. You can’t just buy one from the electric bike dealers. I think they mark things up ridiculously, believing they are selling to your more affluent liberals (or that’s my hypothesis). And I’ve heard things from bicycle people about bicycles, but I’ve never owned one that cost more than, maybe $200, and they’ve all functioned decently, more-or-less.
**”I’ve never owned one that cost more than, maybe $200, and they’ve all functioned decently, more-or-less.”**
I’ve never been a bicycle snob, but there’s a big difference between functioning properly and being a pleasure to ride- especially on long rides.
I recently sold my old Klein to someone who just wanted a bike so he could get some exercise “during the pandemic”. He had never ridden a “good bike”. He was blown away after a short test ride!
Morning, Nunz!
My buddy Jeff is a serious cyclist (like Jeremy). He has a bike that is made entirely of carbon fiber (well, the frame) and the thing is so light you can literally pick it up almost as easily as a housecat. Of course, that lightness lightened his wallet by a sum I hesitate to mention. But I’ve spent an equal sum on my housecats – so it pencils, I guess!
Hey Eric!
Funny thing: Bikes are a lot like cars in the sense that price-wise, there is a point of demarcation between bare-bones “just functional” vs. decent quality and performance, at one end; and a demarcation between good quality/performance vs. diminishing returns for exponentially higher prices.
It’s like: You can get a Walmart bike for $149 which will get you down the road…but will be heavy and clunky and have feeble brakes, and cheesy non-standard parts.
You can get a reasonably light bike with smoothly functioning components and good brakes, which will be a pleasure to ride and easy to keep so, for $1000-$2500.
And then you get into the REALLY light bikes, with state-of-the-art components…..but the improvements over the reasonably light bike won’t really make any noticeable difference for anyone but a professional racer to whom shaving a few seconds off of a 26-mile ride will mean anything- and that bike will be a lot more fragile and easily damaged.
My Klein weighed 19 lbs. (I had bought it used for $700- It had cost $2300 when new in ’97)- relatively “heavy” by cycling standards- but you could lift it on one finger placed under the saddle- and it was a world of difference compared to a 29 lb. Walmart bike or Schwinn.
I briefly had a Specialized Venge -purchased when a year old for a great price. I just wanted to see what all the fuss was about “really good bikes”. It weighed 17 lbs.- which is considered acceptably light by tyoday’s standards.
The Venge had cost $5K when new (!)- I got it for $1800 (Never intended to keep it- it was cheap enough for what it was that I knew I could sell it and get my money back). Rode the Venge for a few months. It was nice…cool, and all that. Looked really good. But as far as actual riding….it gave me no benefit over my Klein- in fact, I prefered the aluminum Klein to the carbon Venge.
Ended up selling the Venge for $2300. So I got to see what all the fuss was about…and even made a profit!
Hi Nunz,
With regard to electric bikes: Assuming you’re in decent shape, it doesn’t strike me as much of an advantage to electrify a bicycle since pedal power can achieve 10-15 easily and faster than that on the downhills and you never run out of range! I know, hills. Going up them. But is there an electric bike that can ascend a 6-9 percent grade at 10-15 MPH (or 30) for any length of time? I would expect such duty to kill its range, fast. And then you have a bike that is much heavier to pedal.
Adding adequate power (batteries) and performance (bigger motor) makes it heavier still – and now you’ve basically got an electric scooter or even a motorcycle – which is fine, but not much of a bicycle, either.
Maybe I’m off about this – I admit to knowing little about electric bikes – but that’s my impression of the things.
My impression of them would be the same as yours. Being a user of many Milwaukee electric hand tools–the batteries are much better than 20 years ago–but heavy torque duty still kills them fast.
We recently tried an electric saw. It was supposed to be all the rage. The battery was supposed to last as long as a tank of mixed gas. The idea was that you have 2 batteries and we should be good to go for most of our routine cutting. How nice would it be to not have to deal with mixing the gas for the old Husqvarna’s? Well, the battery would last as long as a tank of gas if you were cutting tin or plastic. Reinforced concrete was a totally different story.
Long story short, our supplier got the saw back from us. He also got one back from another contractor for the same reasons.
In places where our gas saws have extra energy for the job, batteries are comparable. In heavy duty application where all the energy is being used, batteries gimp and slow the whole process. They are inferior. To say nothing of the weight and size of the battery powered saw which was also inferior to the gas powered saws.
Electric sounds great in theory. It is great in SOME applications. But, in a variable, changing world there are some major gimps to electrification.
Extrapolating the experience of hand tools out to transportation tells me I want nothing to do with electrification and its many gimps in the real world.
For me–and many, many others–ICE engines are the best option for our lives. Otherwise they’d die on their own merits.
Heh, yeah, Ancap.
After being gimped for years with my older battery tools, on my last project, I just hauled out the old extension cord and used my plug-in circular saw (20 years old)….WHAT A DIFFERENCE!
I’ve been wanting to get new battery tools for years…but I can never bring myself to do it. Their price vs. durability and performance, just doesn’t add up for me. Even if I had to get a generator and a bunch of new corded tools, it wouldn’t cost any more than rechargables…but would offer far superior performance and durability. Slicing through 2-bys in 2 seconds all day sure beats slicing through them in 5 seconds…then 15 seconds..then throwing the battery on a charger while ya repeat the same scenario with it’s replacement.
Been wanting an impact driver. How long would the charge last removing 8 lugs per wheel on my vehicles? Betcha I couldn’t R and R one wheel on a single battery…much less 4 wheels! (64 total twists)- Probably would heat the damn gun up and burn it out even if the batteries lasted the job!
Tired of this rechargeable crap!
I actually have been impressed with Milwaukee impacts for what I use them for. The 5.0 battery will actually rattle off rusty bolts on old water fittings. Corded tools are superior but down in a hole six or 7 ft deep it’s handy to not have a cord attached. Above the ground and especially in a shop plug in is the way to go.
On smaller tools they have improved much. Larger tools that take a lot of power are still severely gimped. Application is what makes the difference for sure.
Just like electric auto lovers, you will hear all the positives and none of the negatives of rechargeable power tools. They have to make themselves feel good about spending a fortune on something not as functional in many situations.
Actually, I broke down and spent $300 some on a 20V lithium 3/4 impact from Harbor Freight. It broke the nuts and studs loose on the Budd wheels on my 50 year old International truck which I literally couldnt get with a 6 foot cheater with my svelte 220 lbs bouncing on the end. It has basically replaced my air impacts- no I don’t use it all day but it will do all 4 8 bolt wheels on my 3/4 ton dodge without getting tired. Cordless tools have a place and a lot of them are pretty darned good. Even Harbor freight crap…
DAAAAARRRRNNnn! Ernie!
THAT is impressive!
Got a link to the exact one ya have? (Have to be careful with HF- some of their stuff is great [my angle grinder]…and some is junk [some of their other angle grinders] )
One of the things you need to watch out for with HF is even their more “premium” brands of power tools only have a 90-day warranty. So, by the time you pay more for a decent length warranty (you’re really pre-paying the wholesale cost of the tool) the price winds up in the territory of more established brands that come with 3-5 year warranties right out of the box.
Of course some of their older, junkier brands like “Chicago Electric” are so cheap, who cares about an extended warranty, things like a $12 drill or $9 heat gun are disposable.
Heh, very true, Jason. Their stuff can run the gamut from sub-Walmart to mediocre. You gotta know what you’re buying…before buying.
The thing with many of HF’s rechargeable tools, is that they’re often not all that cheap…and the fact that most of ’em appear to be “stand-alones” -you’d have to have different batteries and different charger for each tool- kinda kills it.
Something like an impact driver though, I could live with just having a separate charger and couple of batteries…assuming the battery wasn’t some orphan which ya could never get replacements for in the future.
I’d be curious to see Ernie’s [read in the context of an unblemished record of staunch heterosexuality] tool. 😀
Here’s the link-
https://www.harborfreight.com/20v-max-lithium-34-in-cordless-xtreme-torque-impact-wrench-kit-64350.html
it claims 1400 lb*ft- and like I said it has worked miracles for me.
On Old Budd truck wheels the inside dual is a inside/outside threaded stud with a flange to hold the wheel, then the outer dual goes over the stud, then a nut goes on the outside dual and locks the whole thing together.
One of the Budd nuts was siezed to the stud and this sucker simply broke loose the stud and pulled it right THROUGH the Budd wheel outside dual. Nut, stud, and all.
My bad and wrecked a hard to find wheel but damned impressive anyway!
PS- stay the HELL away from my tool…
Thanks, Ernie!
Man, your testimonial is impressive!
$60 for an extra battery…not bad!
…and, your tool is safe!
Hi Eric and others,
Electric bikes are essentially hybrids. The motor is intended to assist, not replace, the rider’s own power. I used to really dislike the whole idea, but I now see their merits. The new ones are quite remarkable and can deliver 30 – 70 miles of assisted riding. Weight is of course an issue, but it’s not overwhelming. The lightest drive system adds a little less than 10 pounds and the heaviest/longest range drive system adds about 20 pounds.
Still, many people think, “what’s the point, if you want exercise just ride a real bike”. What brought me around (I don’t own one and don’t intend to) was the experience of one of my oldest and dearest customers. She’s been an avid cyclist most of her life and I’ve known her well over 20 years. Anyway, in the past few years she’s had some injuries and surgeries and can no longer ride as long, or the type of terrain, she once could. She bought a nice electric gravel bike (essentially road bikes with clearance for bigger tires and wider range/lower gearing), and can now ride the way she did before. She rides with her husband and, with the e-bike, can keep up with him on his regular gravel bike. This is a big deal for her, as riding with him is a big part of their relationship. So, for her, the e-bike has been a godsend.
E-bikes are also very helpful for dedicated bike commuters, for obvious reasons. The rider still provides most of the power and the level of assist (from nothing to full capacity) can be controlled by the rider. Anyway, they meet a very genuine need and, for some, greatly enhance, or make possible, the type of riding they wish to do. They really aren’t Muskmobiles.
Cheers,
Jeremy
Jeremy
Jeremy,
That makes sense. I have no intentions of driving a hybrid car, but it does make sense for some people. At least you have an onboard generator to keep the battery charged.
I was imagining an electric bike like the e-dirt bike/motorcycles. I’ve been told by a guy that they have a range of 70-80 miles and they are less money than an ICE bike. I’m skeptical and they don’t have pedals. Climbing hills and such would surely take this way down.
Hey Eric!
You are correct. I think a good part of the appeal though, for electric bikes, is to people in places like NYC- where if you have something that is still classified as a bicycle, and thus requires no driver’s license, registration, insurance, etc. and can use bike lanes/paths, and be easily stowed (No parking!)…and yet can do 25-30 MPH without pedaling, and thus enable someone to essentially have transportation whcih is more nimble than a car or motorcycle (In traffic, and legality-wise)…without even having to work up a sweat, it can be quite practical.
For a recreational rider, or even neighborhood transportation though? Yeah…doesn’t make much sense….as they are heavy, and essentially useless as a “bicycle”.
But man! If they had existed when I lived in Queens….the idea of being able to go virtually anywhere in the city, much faster than walking or mass transit…and then just carrying it up the stairs and bringing it in the apartment, would have been irresistible!
Riding recreationally in the city could be fun- but it is also very inefficient, as one has to constantly stop…so you can’t maintain momentum. If you had a 10-mile each way commute every day…it would get old real fast.
Check out a few minutes of this:
https://youtu.be/etvQKe4-pVM?t=721
I’ve ridden that Williamsburg Bridge (40 years ago..when I was in my teens!)…it’s a bitch! May not look like he’s going super fast…but by comparison to the pedal bikes and non-modified electric bikes he passes on that long incline…he’s flying! (Most other parts of the country- this guy who pays $12,500 a month rent for a small store front would be driving a luxury car to his bidness…in NYC, a custom electric bike is about as good as it gets, unless you’re a politician or executive! 🙁 )
Eric et al, So, even the 250 watt model made ascending hills MUCH easier, and as far as eating the energy reserves, well, there’s usually a downside to the hill, so there was some equilibrium there. 😉
Also, as some of the people here suggest, you don’t ride an ebike for exercise, but for transportation. And could you pedal as fast as the motor would take you? Yes, but I’ll say I ALWAYS outran people who were simply pedal-powered. The only people on bicycles who were riding faster were those with the 2-cycle engine kits installed. With the 1000 watt model, I don’t think even they would stand a chance. It does work as a hybrid, and I often pedaled a little, especially from a dead stop. Now, maybe someone with a $2,000, 3-ounce, metamaterial bike could’ve taken me, but I never saw it. Also, I used to ride the light-rail with it (but f%$& the light-rail!). I’d quickly remove the lead acid battery pack and easily hang the bike up on the provided hooks. So, it wasn’t TOO heavy. The 1000 watt model is more cumbersome, but not more so than the 2-cycle kit bikes, which I’ve also dealt with. Assembly and maintenance of the 2-cycle kit bikes is a pain in the d&%$, BTW. A 1000 watt kit bike has a HEAVY advantage there, in my opinion. 😉
Hi BaDnOn,
It sounds fun! I’ve never seen much less ridden one; would like to try, though…
It IS fun! Especially the 1000 watt version. I think you’d find it definitely not a “clover” activity. 😉
So, just get your favorite used bike from your local pawn shop and install a kit. The first one I built was a 250W motor on a 10-speed road bike. I used a kit from these guys:
https://hilltopperbikes.com/product-category/electric-bike-kits/
…But, I used lead acid batteries, and the entire cost was about $400. Doesn’t look like they have those anymore. It did around 15 MPH, but was MUCH easier to get around town.
Secondly, I built one using one of these:
https://is.gd/utMWxA
…From Ebay.
Then add something like this, (also from Ebay):
https://is.gd/Ao4mTe
Takes a little creativity to mount the battery.
It was really fun, though I gave it to my stepson, and is currently defunct. Remember to charge the battery and don’t just leave it knocked over in the dirt for weeks on end, and it might just last you some time. I recommend LiFePO4 batteries because they aren’t likely to explode on you like some other lithium batteries, and have a much longer cycle life.
BaDnOn,
Just to address your 4th point: The Chinese already make sub-$10K electric cars which are quite functional for limited-range driving. I believe Geely is one manufacturer doing so.
I’ll allow someone else to have fun with some of your other points….
They’re LSEVs, or low speed EVs. Unfortunately, because they’re so light, they’d never pass federal safety fatwas… 🙁
See, that’s what I mean. You can make an efficient, and probably speedy electric (or other) car if you just reduce the weight. Now, batteries weight a lot, but if you’re not packing it to go 300 miles, you can be conservative there, too. Less weight requires less power for acceleration, and there’s no reason you have to have something with aggressive acceleration if it’s supposed to be economical. Also, not a great deal of power is needed to keep a vehicle in motion, even at highway speeds, if the profile is engineered properly.
Then, just save your gas vehicle for weekends and road trips. 😉 …That’s if use of the electric vehicle made sense in your particular case, anyway.
But what’s the point, BaDnOn? Just to relocate the emissions from the place where the people who use such cars dwell, and to relocate them to the countryside so that I can breathe them on my acreage, even though I don’t drive 3K miles a year and population density here is light? Uhhh…no thanks!
Let the people who actually use the cars and live in the densely-populated cities have to deal with their own emissions, instead of sending them to me.
Of course, Nunzio. There may be no point for you. Hell, there may be no point for anyone, depending on conditions. I can think of my rural property, though. Once I move there, if I wasn’t going to make gasoline and other hydrocarbons there from the sunlight and soil (which I AM), I might just put the solar energy directly into an electric vehicle, which, like you, I will use sparsely. I still will probably have an electric bike for fun. I’ve found the lack of necessary maintenance wonderful, AND the stealth is an advantage, when you don’t want people to track you in a serene atmosphere. 😉 Or, in such an atmosphere, maybe you just want to let people enjoy their silence as to not be an a$$hole. That is a factor, too. Then comes the raucousness of copious firearms use on my property, and how to not piss off my neighbors and livestock, but I digress… 😉
Hi BaDnOn,
I’ve been ringside seated at the EV Show since the ’90s and watched the focal point shift away from building a light, acceptably performing economy-oriented EV to high-performance luxury-sport vehicles that happen to be battery-powered.
I know, I know… Musk says that fast/sexy/techy EVs will change the image of EVs and that costs will come down. The image has changed, I’ll give him that. But it has warped the point. EVs are no longer about economy and so they are inherently no longer about practicality – even if the range/recharge issues were redressed. A car that few people can afford is a toy, by definition.
And that’s the problem right now.
But thanks to federal safety fatwas, it’s impossible to BUILD a light and efficient EV!
I agree. I hear your average Tesla roadster will pretty much smoke anything else out there. But why start there? Why not make a quality electric equivalent of Honda Civic and make it ubiquitous? But hell, as you stated, it’s a bit more about being a vampire on the public than it is about being a revolutionary, isn’t it? Maybe I’m still woefully ignorant about what drives some people.
Hi BaDnOn,
“Why not make a quality electric equivalent of Honda Civic and make it ubiquitous?”
Better yet, why not push plug-in hybrids like the Volt? Most people don’t drive more than 40 miles a day, which the Volt can handle on EV alone, and it can be recharged overnight on standard household electricity. But, unlike pure EV’s there is no range anxiety, and it doesn’t need a massive, redundant, infrastructure of charging stations, or the massive increase to generating capacity required to make pure EV’s even remotely as practical as an ICE.
Cheers,
Jeremy
Thanks, I’ll investigate.
Many legitimate scientists have disagreed with the conclusion that human activity is causing global warming, or what is now referred to as “climate change” in an apparent attempt to cover all bases. This includes the late Reid Bryson, widely regarded as the father of modern climate science, who referred to the idea as “a bunch of hooey”. The field has become a politically-motivated mess; decades of failed predictions and outright fraud. For many it has become a de facto religion.
The site https://www.realclimatescience.com is one place to go for information contrary to what the alarmists and their accomplices in the media would have us believe.
I’ve been down the rabbit-hole, my friend. I didn’t come to believe in the legitimacy of anthropogenic global warming lightly. I do doubt some of the assertions (were all gonna DIE!). As with any climate change, those who fail to (slowly) adapt will have problems. Is it now politically motivated and used for a tool of control by a horde of goons? Absolutely! Let’s reference SARS-CoV-2, for example. You don’t have to deny the existence of the virus (some do) if you disagree with all the fearmongering and 1984 propaganda involved. You just have to know that it’s one of many viruses out there, dangerous to a select few, and the fearmongering is BS! 😉 What is not helpful is to announce a ban on cars while your whole state burns to the ground because you mismanaged your forests! Seriously! California has SO MUCH unused desert land, it could be harnessed to power the WHOLE WORLD, yet they can’t figure out how to power their own state! I digress…
Hi BaDnOn,
The interested parties exaggerate everything, whether WuFlu or “climate change.” I put the latter in air quotes to make the point about shifting definitions – which is the opposite of scientific. First it was global cooling, then global warming – now it just “changes” – because the data didn’t fit the claims. It’s not unlike the way “the cases!” has replaced the bodies (which never stacked up).
You know what’s fun to do, Eric? Use their own propaganda campaigns against them. To me, the dangers of “climate change” and even the Kung Flu are a good argument for decentralized energy generation and food production. They are an argument for self-reliance and self-sufficiency, and taking responsibility for your own health and nutrition. They argue for the fall of the megacities, and the rise of local economies. They are an argument for the flourishing American individualists. They are and argument for about everything the world’s tin-pot dictators HATE. Come at ’em from that angle. They aren’t prepared. 😉
Hi BaDnOn,
“I didn’t come to believe in the legitimacy of anthropogenic global warming lightly.”
Yes, but there’s a huge difference between anthropogenic global warming and catastrophic anthropogenic global warming. The vast majority of the scientists, falsely labelled “deniers”, believe that human activity is, or could be, causing some warming. The question is how much? The alarmists assert that, due to positive feedback mechanisms, the likely ECS will be 1.5 – 4.5C (some posit as high as 6C) due to a doubling of CO2. The skeptics, or lukewarmers, believe that the likely ECS, due to both positive and negative feedback mechanisms, is likely to be about 1C per doubling. So far the data seems to support the lukewarmer view.
Cheers,
Jeremy
Yep, I agree. I think that these days, those who postulate that 1-2 degree C change are the mainstream, not “deniers”. Considerable diversity in thought exists about what that means for the world, but for some people, it’s always going to be “we’re all going to die unless you do what I say!”. That’s not me. I’m a zealous lover of human liberty and would likely let anyone drive whatever they wanted even if it DID mean 6C. 😉 But I hear I’m a weirdo, haha.
Hi BaDnOn,
Yep, and considerable diversity of thought exists about whether the proposed efforts to combat “climate change” will work, and how much harm they will cause. The economist Robert Murphy has done a lot of work on this and concluded, using the official assumptions of the IPC, that the proposed solutions will produce very little benefit, at enormous cost. Of course, adopting these policies will deliver even more power and wealth to the sociopathic ruling elite. Call me a cynic, but me suspects that’s the real agenda.
Cheers,
Jeremy
Cheers,
Jeremy
So when does reality set in? Asking for a friend.
Struck by the messianic glint in the eyes of the electro bros as they hooted their klaxons for Prophet Elon on Battery Day last Monday, Emperor Newsom thought he would grab the mic and cadge some love.
“Death to the internal combustion engine! Death to the carbon criminals!” thundered the Emperor of California, wrapped in a thick fog of wildfire smoke like a stage-strutting rock star.
I see your hair is burnin’
Hills are filled with fire
If they say I’ll never leave you
You know they are a liar
Drivin’ down your freeways
Midnight alleys roam
Cops in bars, the topless cars
Never saw a woman so alone, so alone
— The Doors, L.A. Woman
“Goodbye and good riddance to gas-powered cars,” dead-tree “newspaper” the Los Angeles Times piled on, from a city veined with freeways built to serve the gasoline motor car.
Well, it’s sundown on the engines
That were made in the USA
Sure was a good idea
Till CARB got in the way
— Bob Dylan, Union Sunset [slightly misquoted]
It won’t take long for Emperor Newsom’s distaff sidekick, princess regent Kalamaty Harris, to join the droning dirge of the nattering enviro-nabobs.
“Federalize CARB! Ban fossil fuel cars! Send ’em the way of the 100-watt light bulb!” Kalamaty will inveigh, thrilling her climate-protesting, EV-driving acolytes.
Volvos and Subarus just aren’t good enough to signal virtue anymore, you see. Those were tragic totems of unwoke Boomer barbarism. We’re so over that, at the dawn of the Harris regency.
————
There is nothing wrong with your Tesla. Do not attempt to adjust the LCD display. We are controlling transmission. This is a Public Safety Power Shutoff (PSPS).
For the next hour, sit motionlessly and we will control all that you see and hear. We repeat: there is nothing wrong with your Tesla. You are about to participate in a great adventure. You are about to experience the awe and mystery which reaches your inner mind from COMMIEFORNIA.
Have a refreshing glass of Newsom’s Jonestown electric Kool-Aid while you wait. Don’t let the door slam your trailer on the way out. Photo:
shorturl.at/cglyW
Leavin’ Kalifornia in the broad daylight [photo]:
https://bit.ly/3mU6iRw
The word “cars” keeps coming up. What about motorcycles? I don’t really see the Angels riding electric scooters or leaving CA. I suppose they could register the bikes in NV/AZ and maintain private fueling stations at their clubhouses? Should be interesting.
Hi cjm!
Bikes are being let alone… for now. But they’ll be caught up with. Indeed, they already catching up. Almost all new bikes now have EFI and computer controls and cats/02 sensors – which almost none had as recently as circa 2000, so more than 20 years after almost all new cars got those things. Bikes will be the mopping up part.
https://www.npr.org/2019/11/08/777752175/with-blackouts-californias-electric-car-owners-are-finding-new-ways-to-charge-up
So range anxiety or a freezer savior? All about location, location, location.
Personally if I had the means and excuse to buy a second car, I’d be seriously looking at a used Volt. But for whatever reason GM did what it always does with niche cars other than the Corvette, abandon it instead of using it as a launching point for a new way of thinking about (in this case) powertrains. Now that everything is a turbo-4 by fiat, they could have easily modified the Volt electric drive to make a high torque hybrid truck engine that could also have a high output inverter. But no, it wasn’t going to go anywhere internally because the C-suite doesn’t understand engineering. Ford seems to get it though. I’ll be very interested to see the reviews of the 2021 F-150 with the “generator,” as a campsite or bug-out vehicle, potentially running the trailer without having to drag along an extra generator.
GM’s been doing that for years now. It goes back to at least the Pontiac Fiero. Just when they got the car right, they bailed on it! They had the right idea but poor execution in the beginning, so it didn’t sell like they thought it would. The suits mistakenly thought that there was no market for a two seat, mid-engine sports car, but they were wrong. The proof in the pudding is that Toyota brought out the MR2, which they sold for years; in fact, they made two generations of the MR2.
The Volt is a good idea too. Instead of being a parallel hybrid like the Toyta Prius, where the electric motor operates in tandem to assist the ICE as needed, the Volt is a series hybrid; that is, the electric motors provide all the propulsion, with the ICE recharging and/or providing juice as needed. Because it doesn’t have to operate over a wide RPM range, the ICE is more efficient and more economical. If one doesn’t drive much during the week, one can go days or WEEKS without fueling-something the Prius and other parallel hybrids can’t do! Ah, but the “geniuses” at GM corporate stopped making the car.
Does anyone really believe that this is just some “spur of the moment” decision? How about the covid-fraud? The coin shortage? The US economic collapse which is happening in slow motion right in front of us? These problems just suddenly happened right? Nazi Newsom just decided “under the circumstances” to issue an order, not a law, which will not hold up in court, to ban gas autos? No, all of this was planned years in advance.
No, and it’s because of what FDR said. He said that NOTHING in politics happens by accident; if something happens in politics, you can bet it was PLANNED that way! I think that the same applies here.
I can’t believe Newsom hasn’t been put out of everyone’s misery yet.
As usual, the Babylon Bee is on point:
https://babylonbee.com/news/state-with-no-electricity-orders-everyone-to-drive-cars-that-run-on-electricity
https://babylonbee.com/news/california-to-replace-cars-with-new-greener-horse-drawn-carriages
Pfft, shows what you know, Dave. Everyone knows that electricity comes from the plugs in the wall. Need more electricity? Just add more plugs!
The California energy “policy” is basically just fake it ’til you make it, just like the business plans of Silly-Con valley startups. Except even Theranos’ fake blood tests probably won’t kill as many people as randomly shutting down the power grid because you think wind and solar panels will someday get to parity with gas, coal and nuclear.
Yeah, you just need to run the electric generators on clean, quiet electric motors. They work but they’ve been suppressed by the right, the climate deniers, and the oil producers.
Nobody ever wants to answer how were going to power a modern technological society on 250 watts/m^2 of solar energy.
“California – the biggest market for cars in the country”.
I’m not certain that will be the case for much longer. People with money are leaving, and those left behind can’t afford any car at all. Certainly no one with a functioning brain is moving there. It’s hard to believe that anyone could so screw up the economy of such a naturally wealthy state, but they’ve managed to do so.
I would consider the automobile market to be on shaky ground in general, given the economic destruction the Psychopaths In Charge have inflicted upon us. It could quite easily degenerate to the pre-model T level of all of them being custom/hand made. It will take a generation to recover, if we do. We are not at the bottom of the slide to enforced poverty we suffer.
Californians VOTED for this! THIS is what they want! Now that they have their utopia, they’re seeing that it’s not paradise, huh?
My thoughts exactly, JWK.
Even arring the very likely prospect of soon-to-come cataclysmic events which will drastically change the entire country into something unrecognizable, it is almost inconceivable to imagine CA. being anything other than a massive third-world slum/Detroit by 2035, where new car sales will even be contemplatable; much less any infrastructure remaining to be concerned with and regulate such things.
Any political jurisdiction contemplating and pursuing such agendas, is committing suicide, and will not have the money nor productive population to even have to worry about their collectivist utopian dreams.
Eric,
I read an article about this on Yahoo or Bloomberg; I can’t remember which now. I do remember that, if you own an ICEV, you can keep it and use it after 2035, but you can’t buy NEW ICEVs after 2035.
The wording of the ban says it only applies to new cars after 2035, but we all know that there will be a defacto ban on the IC car by way of either excessive taxation or fees. There is no way TPTB are going to let us hold onto our oldies. Enjoy being able to drive yourself now because sadly we won’t have that ability for too much longer.
What the Chicoms do is this: give you a FREE license plate for an EV, while charging you $14,000 to put a plate on an ICEV. In China, you can BUY an ICEV, but you’ll pay $14K to put the license plate on it. I could see something similar happening here.
The so-called wealthy should just stick to their polo horses and leave the rest of the untermenschen alone.
Fuckin’ a right! WTF do they get off telling US how to live?