What’s the Charge?

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They tell us that driving an EV will reduce the cost of driving. I just got proof in the mail that it won’t – in the form of my electric bill for last month (December). That was the month I was sent three EeeeeVeeees to evaluate, beginning with the Ford Lightning pickup, followed by the Mach e “Mustang” and concluding with the Mercedes EQS.

As it happened, the latter two arrived during the coldest snap we’ve had in my area in several years, with night-time temps close to (and sometimes below) zero and daytime temps not much higher.

As I discovered – as many discovered – EeeeeVeeees like the cold like Pfizer likes the truth about its “vaccines.” Range plummeted – even when the things weren’t being driven, if they weren’t left plugged in when parked. The charge being depleted as they sat because – unlike non-electric cars – EeeeeeVeees aren’t off when they are parked. Electricity-using accessories – specifically, the heating (and cooling) systems for the battery – remain on, in order to maintain the battery at a temperature neither too cold nor too hot. This being necessary to assure the battery can be charged – and isn’t damaged.

But that takes power – electricity. If the EV isn’t suckling it from its tether, it is depleting it from its charge. Thus, you wake up with less range.

So, it is almost necessary to keep the EV perpetually tethered – and so perpetually suckling.

The charge for this turns out to be astounding.

My monthly power bill is typically around $95-$120 – which it is because we don’t use a lot of power-sapping devices. We heat with wood and (as a back-up) propane. So it’s mostly low-draw stuff such as lights, with the majority of the draw probably being accounted for by the ‘fridge and the microwave and the washer/dryer.

But then I plugged in three new devices – those EeeeeeeeVeeeees. And these devices sucked so much power that my utility bill for December more than doubled. In fact, it almost tripled.

I cannot exactly separate out what it cost me to charge each of these EeeeeeVeees because the utility company does not line-item what it cost to power/charge up individual devices – but I can give you a good idea.

It is about $170.

That is roughly how much my utility bill went up in one month on account of plugging in three EeeeeeeVeees, one after the other, over the course of three weeks in December.  What it works out to is about $56 per week to charge each EeeeeVeeee, roughly equivalent to the cost of a tankful of gas for a typical non-EeeeeeeeVeee.

The latter sans the cost of the endless, almost, wait.

It took three days of charging – on “Level 1” (120 volt) household current to put enough charge in the Benz EQS to impart about 70 miles of range – about half of which would be consumed driving the 30 miles into town, leaving just enough (just barely and just maybe) to make it back home . . . for another three days’ wait for a charge enough to drive downtown again. It was the same with the others.

But back to the cost – of the power.

It would cost about $60 at the current $3 per gallon in my part of SW Virginia to put 20 gallons of gas in a non-electric Mercedes S-Class or Ford F150. This being not quite a full tank – for those vehicles – but approximately equivalent to the “80 percent charge” at not-so-fast commercial “fast” chargers you hear EeeeeeVeee people tout. Assuming they are charging.

And leaving aside the having to drive there – and the wait there.

The take-home point being it doesn’t cost much (if anything) less to charge an EeeeeeVeeeee at home. It also costs about the same to charge them at a “fast” charger – where they charge you more for the time you don’t save. It cost me about $20 at an EV-no-Go “fast” charger to instill about 100 miles of range in the Ford Lightning – equivalent to less than give gallons of gas – in about an hour and fifteen minutes of waiting.

And never mind the rising cost of the EeeeeeeVeeee, itself.

These devices draw a lot of power, in part because they need to be kept plugged in and drawing it for hours – and days – to recover even a partial charge. It is akin to leaving all the lights on all the time. Probably an under-estimate of the draw.

On 240 volts, the draw would almost certainly be higher – in order to be “faster.” The latter in air quotes to mock the etymological abusiveness of characterizing a 9-11 hour wait (the typical time it takes to recharge an EeeeeVeeee via 240 “Level 2” charging, which is the “fastest” charging that can be achieved at a private residence unless it it has been upgraded to commercial-grade power delivery, at a cost higher than the cost of a new EeeeeVeeee, itself) as “faster.”

It is akin to referring to drugs that do not prevent you from getting a sickness – or spreading it to others – as a “vaccine.”

Keeping an EeeeVeeee plugged in to a 240V outlet – which you’ll probably need to have wired up, at your expense – would be like keeping a stove or dryer drawing electricity for hours on end. One can only imagine what the charge for that would be.

The take-home point is that charging an EeeeeVeee is hardly free – and it’s apt to become even less so as demand for electricity goes up, on account of plugging in more EeeeeeVeeeees.

You won’t be saving much – if any money – at any rate. And it’s also going to cost you a lot of time, too.

During which you won’t be going anywhere, either.

. . .

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73 COMMENTS

  1. Lotsa emotional posting on this forum on the subject of EVs. Here’s some rational, experience-based, comments. First, EVs are a good fit for drivers whose typical daily mileage doesn’t exceed their EV range. Especially if their gas price is higher, joule for joule, than their electricity cost. When they have to be driven longer distances, EVs are more of a challenge. So, if they can afford two cars, EVs will often fit the bill – the second car can have a gas tank. Most two-car families also have a garage. It doesn’t have to be heated to stay above freezing most places, either. That will mostly eliminate the need for the battery to keep itself warm enough to charge.
    So, EVs are, essentially, for people who can afford two cars and a garage, which is most middle class folks these days. For one car owners who just want the most efficient transportation, pHEVs are a great answer. For 99 per cent of driving days, when the mileage is short, the battery will cover the range. At most, the ICE may cut on for a few miles. This can be easily managed with cars like the Prius Prime, which I own, so that it doesn’t turn on just as I’m arriving home, resulting in the car not fully warming up (bad). Even in the winter, most of my daily driving is under 25 miles, so the engine is only on when I need it. I have measured the difference between using fuel and using electric, and, depending on where you live, the savings can be enormous. Here, in Canada, gasoline costs about USD 5.50/gallon, while electricity is about .20/kwh. Even at 55 mpg, the smallish battery in the Prime is 1/3 the cost to drive. An easy triple of savings.
    Even in the U.S., where gas prices are kept very low (relative most of the world), most folks electric rates would enable saving about half over gas with a battery-available car. Since I drive cross country a good deal, I’m not a good candidate for a pure EV, but the Prius Prime is an excellent choice for me. Just about every manufacturer offers a pHEV, and there are incentives like purchase price rebates and tax credits in many places, like here, where it’s about 5k.
    Here’s a bit more about home charging vs. public. My Prime, even on level two, can only receive about 13 amps at 240v, or around 3KW max/hour. With an 8.8 kWh battery, of which about 6 or so is usable range, that means my level two charger gets a full charge in about two hours. Many days I have to make two short trips from my suburban location, about 20-25 miles each. I often can recharge between trips, so no gas is consumed on those days.
    Now, if I had a Tesla, which has a battery size ten times larger, my range would be extended to about 200-250 miles, and, since the car’s onboard charger system can receive more amps, my level two could deliver about 40 amps/hr. I could fully charge a depleted Tesla here in about 9-10 hours. Keep in mind though, it would be rare to need a full charge, since most days I drive well under 250 miles. But, again, not for me since I drive long distances and want to get there without long stops for recharging.
    There are other positives to be mentioned regarding EVs and pHEVs, that rarely get mentioned here in this forum. Most especially the maintenance and vehicle lifespan issues. There are Teslas already out there with over one million miles on them. Original batteries, too. They are a bit hard on tires, but brakes aren’t used much, and, hey, no ICE to wear out or need maintenance/repair. Even my Prius (third one I’ve owned, but the first pHEV) promises much longer engine and brake life, since both are used much less. Bugaboos about the battery are mostly just that; battery tech is moving forward more rapidly than most other automobile tech, so that in five or ten years, should any car’s drive battery need replacing, there are almost surely going to be after-market solutions that are reasonably-priced, and may offer higher performance than OE. (Already the case with older Priuses.)
    So… just a few words in defence of EV tech. They are not for everybody, and absolutely agree the should not be forced down our throats, but they are absolutely a great choice for folks whose driving needs fit. This place has begun to sound like a reactionary buggy whip manufacturer hangout in the early years of the twentieth century! 🙂

    • Hi Anon,

      There’s emotional – and there’s factual. Here’s the most important fact, in my opinion: EVs are being heavily pushed. They are not an organic development. Absent the regulations that are making it difficult to continue building cars that aren’t at least partially “electrified” (i.e., hybrids) and the regulations (and subsidies) that encourage the manufacture/sale of EVs, there would be very few EVs, for the simple reason that EVs are much less practical and far more expensive than otherwise similar cars.

      My point being: This whole EV thing is artificial and so unnatural.

      The whole thing is based on a false premise – that EVs are necessary to prevent “climate change.” This is nonsense and hysteria. That is to say, it is based upon . . . emotions!

      PS: Did you read my article? In it, I explained just how much it cost to charge EVs – and it’s not less than it costs to fuel a non-EV. Especially one that isn’t an energy hog, as most EVs are!

      • Yes, I read it, and I agree that EVs are being pushed, even subsidized. That fact does not change the fact that they are selling like hotcakes. I also agree that this push aligns with all the push to tighten our radius of travel and impose easy further restrictions on our ability to move around! Surprised? You shouldn’t be, as I do see this. This doesn’t change my view that EVs, and especially pHEVs are a good choice for many!
        As to your assertion that they are more costly to fuel than non-EV, I say “that depends.” It depends on the ratio of energy cost between gas and EV. Here it’s three times cheaper to go EV, provided you don’t outdrive your EV range in a day’s driving. In the US, it’s probably closer to only twice as cheap. The conditions you tested under were hardly average. Together with an unusually cold timeframe, you apparently had several EVs at the same time and had to charge some of them outside. I thought I made it clear that most people would have a garage that stayed above freezing. Under those more normal conditions, the batteries would not require supplemental heating to take a charge, so the fuel economy ratio holds.
        As to the AGW arguments, you’re preaching to the choir. Couldn’t agree more. But for those who can avail themselves of the economies that exist, EVs can be a good choice, even if I don’t buy into the AGW hoopla/disinformation. Here’s another example where EVs can really work. If you have a significant solar panel installation, it is possible to charge your EV battery either partially or totally for “free.” I know of several who do this. In their cases, the savings are astronomically higher.
        IMO, the reason most of the EVs are selling so well is people are realizing what a good fit they are for their own economic situation. Do they cost more upfront? Absolutely. But the economy over a five or ten-year ownership period can be highly alluring. For me, pHEV was a huge wakeup call. Your review of the Prius Prime last year actually contributed to my decision to go with my current drive, so thanks for begin open enough to publish that! Consider running your tests again under more normal weather conditions, and with in-garage charging. I’ll bet you will need to revise your conclusions. It’s not cold all year, even up here in the great white north, and my EV only range is nearly double in the summer. Overall, it’s a clear winner, even with a 400 lb battery weighting my Prius down. It actually even handles better than the Gen III it replaced, with improved weight distribution front/rear!

        • Hi Aanon,

          EVs are selling – but for how long – and to how many? Unless the prices come down radically (and the opposite is happening) EVs have an inherently limited sales potential as they are fundamentally luxury-priced cars. Only so many people can afford to drive a Lexus or a BMW… or Tesla.

          We agree on hybrids. I’m a fan as well. Their buy-in cost is relatively low (unlike that of most EVs) and the savings on gas can quickly amortize that. I should be getting the new Prius to test drive shortly!

    • ‘battery tech is moving forward more rapidly than most other automobile tech, so that in five or ten years …’ — anon

      … ‘recharging your EeeVee will be too cheap to meter!’ /sarc

      Meanwhile, in the product where the battery weight/capacity tradeoff is the most critical — cell phones — where is the promised great leap forward in battery tech?

      Phone batteries are sized to support about 10 hours of heavy use on a charge, and no more. A bigger battery would make the phone too thick and heavy.

      If some great advance in battery tech could double the weight:capacity ratio, surely Apple would be all over it. But, crickets.

      The ‘magic battery’ carrot has been dangling in front of our faces on a stick for years now … and ever shall be. It gives this bitter carbon clinger a bad case of “man’s PMS.” Keep your distance!

  2. A major beef I have is that “electrifying” is putting all of your “energy eggs” in one basket, so to speak.

    That means that in a power outage, never mind a grid failure, you’re utterly stuck.

    With even a minimal diversification of my energy consumption (gas logs, a gas range, and a gas water heater, not to mention my non-electric car), I am far better off than someone whose entire house is electric, and who drives an EV. No only are you extremely vulnerable if the power goes out, you can’t even bug out to safer shelter.

    It also means that if electricity rates go up a lot, you’re paying through the nose.

  3. Heres a true story. My BIL who has the Model 3 moved and now has to use public charging points to recharge. He never cared before because his old apartment allowed fixed cost charging.

    Now as he is paying himself – he’s noticed the following interesting things
    1) The car which had a 340 mile range now only has 280 after about 2 years old.
    2) Using public chargers he pays the same or more than I pay to run my big diesel SUV (v6 Fpace, bigger and more luxurious than the model 3). (Home charging will be a bit less).
    3) For every 10 mile he drives – the thing consumes 20 miles of range in this weather!!

    ie he’s pissed and wants them to figure out whats wrong with it – but I’ve told him not to hold his breath !

  4. i think you will have to buy a meter to measure electricity use at the receptacle being used to charge the EVs. The overall monthly electric bill identified the surprising cost but is not precise enough. 115 volts for charging is not good enough. And you ought to have a heated garage and own two EVs not one — so one can be used while the other is charging. Better yet — have no EVs!

    Engineers working on 2026 EVs here in Micgigan are reaching unprecedented levels of depression — they wonder who will want to own them, because of :

    The high cost

    The mysterious, unpredictable percentage charged gauges

    The refueling inconvenience and time required

    The extra cost of fast charging, or rewiring the home for 240 volts in the garage

    The refueling cost vs. gasoline if gas is near $3 a gallon rather than $5

    The cold weather problems, including surprising -40% to -60% range reductions in extremely cold weather. Including range reductions while sitting in coldm unheated garages.

    The only advantage of EVs is usually fast acceleration, if that’s important to the buyers, but is not something safe in city traffic or on crowded roads. The cost of larger electric motors with fast acceleration is not that much more than smaller motors with slower acceleration, so smaller motors are not much of a cost reduction opportunity.

    If the engineers currently designing the 2026 EVs here in Michigan are very unimpressed with EVs, that’s a bad omen for the auto industry and potential consumers. This is the only website where EV reviews correlate with what the EV engineers are saying. Almost everywhere else reviews EV’s like they are cheerleading for the $#@%$ “transition”.

    *********************************************************

    “It is akin to referring to drugs that do not prevent you from getting a sickness – or spreading it to others – as a “vaccine.” ”

    Please stop repeating the above myth. It is wrong. Y ou can say anything negative about the vaccines, as I have been doing for over two years, but they ARE vaccines.

    The mRNA Covid vaccine might be a failed vaccine experiment, but right now we can not disprove Pfizer’s claim of a 1% absolute risk reduction. That’s not much. But if there is ANY absolute risk reduction from Covid symptoms, it can not be called a failed vaccine.

    It is a dangerous vaccine that may have a tiny benefit if you trust Pfizer test data for a mere two months of testing of relatively healthy people (I don’t trust Pfizer at all). The Pfizer Covid vaccine is the least safe, and least effective, vaccine in history — a medical disaster in my opinion — BUT IT IS A VACCINE.

    In general, most vaccines do not completely prevent infection but do prevent the infection from spreading within the body and from causing disease.

    Meanwhile. Donald Trump is claiming his vaccines saved 100 million lives, when there is no evidence they saved one life. The man is deluded.

    • ‘they ARE vaccines’ — Richard Greene

      On Sep 1, 2021, CDC changed the definition of vaccine from ‘confers immunity’ to ‘stimulates an immune response,’ specifically to accommodate non-sterilizing covid jabs.

      By the old definition, still intuitive to most people, covid jabs which don’t stop infection or transmission do not qualify as vaccines.

      In addition, any absolute risk reduction from covid symptoms must be balanced against adverse event risk due to the jab itself. For most age cohorts, adverse event risk from the jab exceeds the reduction of risk (if any) from covid symptoms. ==> patent, iconic, archetypal, textbook #FAIL.

      • Study the history of vaccines.
        They do not prevent infection
        You must be inventing some “old definition”
        They hopefully equip the body with antibodies to fight the infection

        If there is an infection, there can be spread, even with vaccines
        Vaccines hopefully reduce the time and seriousness of the infection, to make spread less likely — that is the goal

        The official CDC definition of a vaccine is worthless.
        Who listens to the CDC?

        We have centuries of experience to define vaccines

        Where was the first vaccine created?

        Edward Jenner, a country doctor living in Berkeley (Gloucestershire), England, who in 1796 performed the world’s first vaccination. Taking pus from a cowpox lesion on a milkmaid’s hand, Jenner inoculated an eight-year-old boy, James Phipps.

        How do vaccines work?

        “Vaccines stimulate the human body’s own protective immune responses so that, if a person is infected with a pathogen, the immune system can quickly prevent the infection from spreading within the body and causing disease. In this way, vaccines mimic natural infection but without actually causing the person to become sick.”
        SOURCE OF QUOTE
        https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/vaccines/vaccines-faq

        The two months of Pfizer testing, with the healthiest subjects Pfizer could recruit — almost no senior citizens — allegedly had a 1% absolute risk reduction. Some patients died in those two months, but Pfizer determined the deaths were unrelated to Covid (or the Covid vaccines) — quite a convenient financial conflict of interest.
        I have to suspect there were some serious vaccine side effects in those two months and I hope some whistleblower will reveal them someday. The actual adverse side effects were already a disaster in early 2021 VARS data, which I followed every week.

        • Richard,

          In common usage, until just now, a vaccine was understood to be that which immunizes the person; i.e., having been vaccinated, the person was not going to become infected and (by dint of that) could not transmit the sickness he was vaccinated against.

          It is specious – it is evil – to allow the passage of the oily redefinition of vaccine to “reduces symptoms,” as has been precisely the case. Especially as people were lied to about these drugs that aren’t”vaccines.” Pfizer, et al and Biden, et al, assured people they would be immunized if they got “vaccinated.” Not that their “symptoms would be reduced.”

          These drugs are not “vaccines.” They are – at best – palliatives. Like aspirin. But – unlike aspirin – these drugs come with serious risks that would never have been countenanced in the Before Time of three goddamn years ago. Am I angry. You better believe it.

          The bastards must be held to account – and anyone who defends them, as well.

          • Please do not continue to undermine yourself !
            Vaccines create antibodies that fight infections
            They do not prevent infections
            That is basic medical science
            The Covid vaccines do create SARS2 antibodies
            They may not be very effective antibodies for very long, and can be high risk, but they are created, and Pfizer claims they have a tiny effect in fighting infections so that symptoms will be reduced about 1%. Many infections are fought without the patient being aware — sometimes there is low energy for an hour or feeling under the weather for a day. They are possible symptoms when your body’s immune symptom is fighting an infection. But almost all infections are promptly destroyed by your immune system without you noticing. Some bacteria and viruses can successfully infiltrate the body and lie dormant without causing any symptoms for many years until they suddenly flare up.

            • Richard,

              Plain English. A vaccine has historically – until just recently – always been understood to confer immunity. To prevent infection and transmission. Hard stop. Period.

              This is the basis upon which these drugs – which are not vaccines – were falsely sold to (and forced upon) the public. They were told they would not get the ‘Rona – and could not spread it to others. In other words, the public was lied to. Fact. Hard stop.

              The polio vaccine does not “reduce the symptoms” of polio.

              If a drug does not confer immunity – if it does not prevent infection/transmission – then it is a palliative at best and there is no moral case to be made for pressuring (let alone forcing) anyone to take it for the sake of other people’s “safety.” Period. Because there is no benefit to other people. Put another way, you are not “protecting” anyone else by taking these drugs – and may well be hurting yourself.

              These drugs are “vaccines” like a “life vest” that doesn’t keep you afloat but smells good is a “life vest.” Anyone who insisted people at sea wear such “life vests” would be regarded – rightly – as an ignoramus criminally reckless and an asshole.

              You “undermine” decency when you compose apologias for the scumbags pushing these drugs – and for the drugs, themselves.

              I undermine nothing by pointing out the facts about these scumbags and their drugs that aren’t vaccines.

              Pick a side.

              This is war. And there will be no prisoners taken when it goes hot.

  5. “Where’s the charge?” cry burned Woke investors:

    ‘Shares of electric vehicle charging companies fell ahead of Thursday’s open, after Wallbox said it was cutting about 15% of its workforce to reduce costs.

    ‘Shares of Wallbox lost 1.8%, Blink shed 2.6%, ChargePoint slid 3.2%, EVgo dropped 3.1% and Volta gave up 2.8%.

    ‘Wallbox said the job cuts come as disruptions in global supply chains hurt EV delivery rates.’

    https://archive.ph/x4SEo#selection-2147.22-2147.115

    Sounds contrived — most surveys show that supply chain issues have eased greatly.

    What Wallbox can’t confess is that EeeVee Fever is over, switched off like a porch light covered with bugs.

    Some buyers are priced out. Others just don’t want what’s on offer. It was all just a mad, bad dream.

  6. I built an energy efficient house and an engineer friend gave me a home made watt-hour analog meter so I could measure each appliance and figure out how much power each item was drawing.

    The local utility supplied the meter for free, and the base he got out of the junk pile, looks like this:

    https://mebamcb.files.wordpress.com/2021/06/meba-meter-sockets-gtfp200a7j-1.png

    Temporary job site meters will work, or even mobile home meter bases. And if you look around you can find them free.

    Then you rig it up so it is just like a utility cord. One end is male and the other female, and you put it in between your power outlet and appliance. It is very simple to do, and the meter must be vertical or it will not read right.

    I soon found out that 80% of my electric bill was for the hot water tank (the house was all electric with a wood stove).

    So to cut my electric usage to bare bones, I got a used hot water tank and put it on a pedestal in the garage, with the house wood stove on the other side of the wall. I made some heat exchangers so when the woodstove was on, it would preheat the water that fed the normal electric hot water tank, by thermosiphoning.

    (I used a roll of flexible copper tubing)
    https://i.pinimg.com/736x/de/5f/02/de5f027cb24569935e590798f39205ca.jpg

    My first try was copper tubing around the stove pipe and it did not work very good:
    https://i.pinimg.com/originals/79/f2/46/79f246b2e6398c497c4ec03ec1ce895e.jpg

    (NOTE: heat exchangers on the outside of the stove do not work that well)

    The second try it worked much better than expected, as the preheat tank was hotter than the hot water tank, so that meant my hot water tank almost never came on (this was in the winter) and my electric bill dived below $20. I was quite happy with my savings, but one day the electrical company truck showed up and replaced the house watt hour meter, thinking that my low bill was due to a faulty meter, so I explained to him, he didn’t seem to care, just doing his work order.

    Later I moved and built another super energy efficient house with double 2×4, 12″ walls. (super easy to do). So once again I wanted to preheat my water tank, but the garage was below the living space. So a hippie pot grower friend, who lived off the grid, showed me a trick. He gave me an Amish built in the wood stove cast iron heat exchanger. Man, did that work, beaucoup hot water, it lays on the floor of the wood stove, you just have to drill or torch out plumbing holes on the side.

    So from experience if you want to cut your electric bill and be self sufficient, heating your own hot water from firewood is a good way to go. You want the heat exchanger INSIDE the stove, that means you have to have the right stove, and a cast iron heat exchanger that fit together.

  7. In the Great Left Coast State of Washington, the charging cables are worth a few $$ in Copper.
    Thieves get (maybe) $10 and the replacement costs a couple of thousand and 3 to 6 months replacement time. Cutting catalytic converters requires crawling under an auto. This is easier.
    Any Copper wire not hidden/protected is easier. Government wants to spend $5 Billion on chargers.
    What could go wrong?

    • Hi John,

      My sister in San Diego has had the cat cut off her Honda twice. After the second time, I advised them to raise the black flag and just run the car without it, “legality” be damned. Just like the illegal aliens do.

  8. container ships bring all the lithium batteries and EV critical car parts from china….. each consume 28,000 liters of fuel per 1000 km.

    just 16 of these ocean freighters cause more environmental harm, than all the gasoline powered cars, in the world.

    Re: EV’s and grid upgrade equipment……

    China has infiltrated all levels of governments, taken control, (check out the leftist/communist takeover), your politicians bought off, paid to push the EV agenda.
    Anybody pushing EV’s is a paid ccp shill.

    Who benefits the most from the EV vehicle conversion? china does.

    All the most important components in the new EV’s are all made in china.
    80% of the lithium fire bomb batteries in EV’s are made in china….in factories powered by coal….lol
    Then you are dependent on china for replacement parts, etc., in effect they take over the whole vehicle supply chain. Vehicle production then centralized in China.

    the chinese are taking over the electric car market, they are starting to export their EV’s worldwide, their EV’s are supposed to be advanced and cheap, they will kill off the other manufacturers……

    the chinese make most of the chips, maybe the shortage was to help their EV launch….lots of their cars coming here soon
    at this rate everyone will be driving a chinese car soon, a lot of electronics in your car are made there already…….

    no wonder tesla moved a lot of production to china…
    china…..it is where most rare earths are processed; and most of the mineral supply-chains for electric vehicles lead there, with existing supply sewn up.

    With more EV’s the grid has to be upgraded, most of the equipment for expanding the grid is made in china.

    The largest beneficiaries are the Chinese manufacturers of electric transformers, cables, generators, etc. since almost none of that stuff is made anywhere else anymore.
    If there is a war and china detonates a neutron bo mb that takes out the grid, they get to supply all the replacement equipment, another win for them.

    What about all the vac cin,,,,,es and drugs the government has been pushing, all the ingredients come from china, they benefited the most from the bat germ bs narrative.
    china was chosen to lead the wef great reset, they probably cooperate to help their own agenda

  9. Gaining three to five miles of charge per hour is typical for 120-volt charging. Not for everybody, though:

    ‘A man discovered on Sunday that his brand new GMC Hummer EV would take five days to fully charge when using a basic home charging setup.

    ‘”This is a brand new Hummer and it’s got the largest battery you can buy,” he announces. “250-kilowatt hours of battery in this truck.”

    ‘”Time to complete charge: Friday at 8:30 am and range increase is one mile per hour,” he said, making a total charge time of five days.’

    https://thepostmillennial.com/watch-man-discovers-it-will-take-6-days-for-his-hummer-ev-to-fully-charge

    His lawn is snow-covered, and he sounds Canadian. Probably the parasitic load of keeping the giant battery warm while parked outside in the driveway slows range increase to a crawl.

    Conceivably if it gets cold enough, all the 120-volt power would be needed just to warm the battery (like a block heater), and no miles of range would accrue at all. Hosed!

    • >‘”This is a brand new Hummer and it’s got the largest battery you can buy,”
      I read recently (don’t have a reference) that the weight of the battery pack on one of thee vehicles is ~2900 lb, out of a GVW of ~9000 lb.

      If that is correct, an IC powered Hummer would weigh ~6000 lb, or 2/3 the weight of an all electric version. Even with regenerative braking, it appears there will be a *huge* energy consumption penalty for dragging around an extra ton and a half of batteries, vs. IC engine and fuel tank(s). F=ma, phuckers.

  10. Re: 15A garage circuits, code when I built back in 2007 was a separate 20A for each stall of the garage. In my old house, back in ’95, when I wanted a new outlet in my garage, it had to be 20A because there was only 15A from the builder, and code had changed in the meantime. I don’t know when NEMA changed, but it was evidently between ’78 (when that house was built) and ’95, when I wanted to run power to the other side of my 2-stall garage.

  11. One of the available add-ons for my solar inverter is a car charger. The inverter can shunt power to the charger, to the grid, a back up battery or some combination of the three. The charger plug itself is fairly cheap but of course the solar system was very expensive. If I ever purchase a plug-in hybrid I’ll probably have a car charger installed.

    But the idea that the power from the inverter is somehow free ignores the cost of the system, and what I might have done with the ~$8000 (after rebates) instead. When it comes to investing I try to imagine what “future me” will say to “past me.” For example, past me was livid while I was making double and tripple payments to the mortgage because I had to suffer in coach and eat my own cooking, but future me was really happy to dump that monthly libility in half the time. Past me was happy to get a tax writeoff and healthy refund for installing solar panels. Future me was happy to pre-pay the next 10-15 years of electric bills. And it would be nice to offset some transportation expense too, if there’s actual savings to be had.

    Not sure what my point is, other than most of the people who want electric cars are also heavily invested in “green” energy cons. Thanks to ESG rules, they can’t have XOM in their portfolio so they try to gin up support for battery cars, hoping to boost up demand for their malinvested capital in wind and solar that isn’t paying out the returns expected. Because you can sell electricity that isn’t being produced.

    And yes I see the irony…

    • I have a dual battery set-up and use a RedArc charger for the second. It has a built-in solar controller but I’ve never used that function. Not sure which solar panel to buy to keep everything charged when not running. It’s on my list to check.

  12. EeeeVeeees are heavier than their ICE counterparts, thus ultimately consume more energy to travel the same distances at the same speeds as any other vehicle powered by any other source. Physics 101. Any questions?

    Of course, only government can assert that the use of heavier vehicles will somehow use less energy, and through their mouthpieces of academia and the media, actually get a significant percent of the population to also believe such an absurdity.

    We have truly entered a dark, dark age.

    • This is, and has always been, my 1st point with any EV fanboi. EVs don’t change the reality of physics. It takes x amount of energy to move y mass z distance, and increasing y or z increases x. Then you can start adding in all the other disadvantages of production, supply, transmission, and storage of electricity, aka fuel. And the EV pushers don’t like to discuss ANY of the aforementioned items whatsoever, all of which are primary strong points of gasoline & diesel transport. Next to the “global Warming/ Climate Change, “green” energy is the most aggregious lie and con of the modern age, maybe even the worst, actually. High School math and physics can debunk all of it in just a few pages, and yet this “educated” society buy the B.S. hook, line, and stinker!

    • Yeah….20 mpg for an EV….lol

      ATTENTION: This is really bad….Before the EV (with a 40 kWh battery) goes one foot the emissions/pollution just from manufacturing it is equal to driving an ice diesel 89,400 km (50,550 miles), about 7 years driving. This shows how stupid the government is pushing EV’s with their lithium fire bomb batteries (95% of lithium batteries are NOT recycled), this is an environmental catastrophe.

      “If an electric vehicle is using a 40 kWh battery (some EV’s have 90 kwh batteries which are 2.25 x as bad ), its embedded emissions from manufacturing would then be equivalent to the CO2 emissions caused by driving a diesel car with a fuel consumption of 5 litre per 100 km (about 55 mpg), up to 89,400 km (about 7 years average driving) before the electric car even has driven one meter,” Circular Energy reports.

      Then the battery dies in 10 years and you start over, another 89,400 km equivalent of pollution, (per 40 kwh battery), inflicted on the earth, just from the battery manufacture…lol….and it will only cost you $22,000…lol…

      Ice diesel vs EV fuel economy comparison:

      To go 100 miles the ice diesel burns 1.36 gallons of diesel in it’s super clean .000001% emission engine.

      the EPA tells us that modern gas powered cars produce 98 – 99% less pollution than cars from the 1960s and 1970s. modern cars have .000001% emissions but that isn’t good enough they want zero, they are liars though, the new EV’s pollute more…lol

      To go 100 miles the EV burns 43 lb of coal…… 43 lb of dirty coal were burnt to generate the electricity in the power station producing huge emissions destroying the environment.
      ATTENTION: remember they are CEV’s Coal Electric Vehicles….
      Plus the added bonus of a lithium fire bomb battery in the car….lol

      ATTENTION: The Volkswagen Golf BlueMotion ice diesel has emissions of 85g CO2 per km

      the VW XL1 hybrid diesel produced emissions of 21g of CO2 per km…far cleaner then an EV….

      A current-model large EV car emits about 88 grams of CO2 per kilometer,…EV’s are way dirtier….lol

      Ice diesel:
      The 2014 Volkswagen Golf BlueMotion diesel, capable of a claimed 88.3 mpg imperial, or 73.5 mpg U.S.
      it has a 971 mile range, the perfect car.
      The Volkswagen Golf BlueMotion has emissions of 85g CO2 per km. it is even cleaner (less emissions) than a Toyota Prius or an EV….
      A bloomberg article states, “A current-model large EV car with a battery produced and charged in an average European Union country emits about 88 grams of CO2 per kilometer,

      it weighs 1125 kg, 2480 lb, the new EV’s are over 4000 lb. it weighs 40% less.

      EV
      What test drivers are actually getting driving in the real world driving EV’s is they are getting 2.4 miles of range for every kwh
      They are using 41.66 kwh to go 100 miles. (.4166 kwh per mile) = 83 mpg
      ATTENTION: 83 mpg is based on electricity just coming out of a wall plug,
      in reality 4.80 gallons of fuel or 43 lb of coal were burnt to generate the electricity in the power station = 20.8 mpg).
      So to go 100 miles the EV burns 43 lb of coal

      So to end up with 41.66 kwh of electricity which is equivalent to 1.20 gallons of gas to push the EV 100 miles down the road 4.80 gallons of fuel or 43 lb of coal were burnt to generate the electricity in the power station, remember net 25% efficiency. 100 miles using 4.80 gallons = 20.8 mpg,

      New EV’s are over 4000 lb, that is why they get bad fuel economy. The 2014 Volkswagen Golf BlueMotion diesel weighs 40% less, helping it to get far greater fuel economy.

      In the real world the EV with the large 90 kwh battery (some EV batteries are smaller) had only 216 mile range.
      the 2014 Volkswagen Golf BlueMotion diesel has a 971 mile range.

      Energy density:
      In order to go 200 miles the EV had to carry around a 1000 lb battery (some tesla batteries weigh 1800 lb, the hummer battery is 3000 lb.)

      In order to go 200 miles the 2014 Volkswagen Golf BlueMotion diesel had to only carry 9.52 lb of fuel.

      There is the big difference the diesel ice car only had to carry 9.52 lb of fuel to go 200 miles the EV had to carry a 1000 lb battery, this has a huge effect on fuel economy

      The 2014 Volkswagen Golf BlueMotion costs $24,355 U.S., EV’s start at about $45,000
      there is a $20,000 incentive to buy the Volkswagen Golf BlueMotion…lol

      20.8 mpg….lol…..these EV’s use more fuel so pollute more then ice vehicles

      most new gas or diesel ice cars get better fuel economy, cost way less, use far fewer resources to manufacture, don’t have lithium fire bomb batteries, last three times as long as EV’s….

      NOTE:
      Thermal efficiency of power plants using coal, petroleum, natural gas or nuclear fuel and converting it to electricity are around 33% efficiency, natural gas is around 40%. Then there is average 6% loss in transmission, then there is a 5% loss in the charger, another 5% loss in the inverter, the electric motor is 90% efficient so another 10% loss before turning the electricity into mechanical power at the wheels.

      33% – 6% – 5% – 5% – 10% = 25% efficiency for EV’s. In very cold weather EV’s are 12% efficient

      a gallon of gas retains 100% of its chemical-kinetic-electrical energy potential throughout the entirety of its supply chain. This is extraordinarily effective when compared to electricity in either transmitted or battery-stored forms – which does not retain its potential and can lose from 15 to 45% of the generated kilowatt hours of electricity during the delivery and battery-charging/depletion/use processes.
      ……… instead of 26% loss (during delivery and use) this says it is up to a 45% loss

      33% – 45% = 15% efficiency for EV’s. Then in very cold weather EV’s are 8% efficient..another 50% loss….
      EV’s are looking pretty useless, they are being pushed on people through lying….

      An EV just sitting loses:
      tesla says a daily 3%-5% stationary range consumption.” (just parked)
      So Tesla says it’s normal to fully discharge itself in under 3 weeks. Keep this in mind when parking it somewhere 90kwh @ $0.40 per kwh = another $36.00 per week loss just parked…lol

      Plus the cost of the battery, which is huge, you have to store the electricity in the very, very expensive battery, that is the killer for EV’s right there, the expensive, rapidly wearing out battery.
      the tesla $22,000 battery is used up, worn out in 100,000 miles.
      ATTENTION: this works out to $22.00 per 100 miles it is costing you for the battery.

      greens say burning 43 lb of coal to power their stupid EV is cleaner then burning 1.36 gallons of diesel in an ultra clean .0000001% emission ice diesel engine….lol….they have lied to everybody and got away with it….lol

      2014 Volkswagen Golf BlueMotion for sale… $6403.00….buy one…

      https://www.motors.co.uk/volkswagen/golf/trim/bluemotion/year/2014/used-cars/

      • An EV just sitting loses:
        tesla says a daily 3%-5% stationary range consumption.” (just parked)
        So Tesla says it’s normal to fully discharge itself in under 3 weeks. Keep this in mind when parking it somewhere 90kwh @ $0.40 per kwh = another $36.00 per week loss just parked…lol

      • They’re not stupid. They want people in vehicles they control. Like the appliances that watch and listen to you. It’s all here, control of your “money” is next.

    • Nunz,

      They don’t give two s#!ts about obeying the Constitution, why should we expect them to treat thermodynamics as anything other than optional?

      Thing is, it’s a whole lot easier to disobey a piece of paper.

  13. Here in Central WA power was extremely reliable up to two years ago. Now several hours long outages, few months ago I was about to get the generator out but after five hours finally restored. Looks to me the infrastructure is showing reliability cracks – a recent Mike Rowe program on hydro dam maintenance was sobering. Aging Hoover Dam with specific skill sets and “tribal knowledge” required to keep it functional.

    WA is all in on EVs, the same crazy game plan of only allowing EV for new cars coming in the 2030s. Oh and got to save those salmon so really need to remove the Snake River dams that provide 10% of our electricity. These virtual signaling morons are going to ruin it for all of us.

    • deferred maintenance on the existing grid is estimated at $5 trillion….they stole all the money…so there isn’t any left to fix it……

      Dr. Marc Faber says these governments steal between 5% (honest governments) and 100% (crooked governments) of the money collected, borrowed……

      Power Grid Could Fail 7 reasons

      Pushing EV’s that use huge amounts of electricity dooms the power grid. Connecting more EV’s to the grid will crash the grid, there will be nowhere to charge your EV.

      If all vehicles are EV’s the grid capacity has to be expanded 500%, that is unlikely to happen, just doing neglected,

      ATTENTION: deferred maintenance on the existing grid is estimated at $5 trillion, to expand it 500% would cost $25 trillion?….

      More capacity isn’t being added to the grid, the opposite is happening, reliable hydrocarbon and nuclear power plants are being shut down, they want to convert to 100% wind turbine and solar panel energy production, which is unreliable, far more expensive, dangerous, fire prone, intermittent, a sometimes power supply. Are they anticipating a much smaller populatiion?

      How Critical is the Grid?
      According to a report from the congressionally funded EMP Commission,
      power grid failure for one year would result in the death of nine out of every 10 Americans.
      The first to die would be people dependent on medical assistance with the majority dying from starvation.

      Systems and services surrounding us are dependent on electricity and without power there are no grocery stores or pharmacies, no gas stations or hardware stores, no local doctors or dentists, no traffic lights, banks, basic communication, water, and everything else we assume will always be available.

      The North American power grid is old.

      The original design was engineered to only last 50 years with the assumption that future generations would upgrade and improve the system. That has rarely happened unless a system or station has a significant failure, and even then the fix falls in the category of repairs, not replacement.

      As a result, there are parts of the North American grid that are about 100 years old. In a study done by the American Society of Engineers the power grid was graded D+ for reliability. It’s troubling to think that a system so critical to our survival is in the range of a failing grade.
      NOTE: a system so critical to our survival ….and they are crashing it with EV’s recharging….is that the point?….or are they low IQ?
      ATTENTION: Worse, some estimates put a critical repair to the North American grid at $5 trillion dollars!

      The power grid that exists today was first built after World War II from designs dating back to Thomas Edison, using technology that primarily dates back to the ’60s and ’70s. Its 7,000 power plants are connected by transmission power lines with a combined total of more than 5 million miles, connecting to millions of miles of distribution lines to final users….all managed by 3,300 utilities serving 150 million customers.

      Every day our power grid is tested by foreign hackers attempting to infiltrate and find ways of taking control and cutting off power. The cutting edge of cyber-warfare continues to be China. Unfortunately, our defenses against cyberattacks continue to be weak.
      NOTE: It is believed in fact at the highest levels of our intelligence community that China could shut down our power grid at any time.
      80% of all important components and batteries in EV’s come from china, they benefit the most from the EV push, …..load us up with EV’s then turn off the power?

      Infrastructure Failure
      It doesn’t take the drama of an attack or catastrophe to take down the grid. The age of the North American grid combined with the intermittent and often random repairs further compromise and complicate an antiquated system that could simply collapse in on itself.

      All it takes is a massive failure at one utility to cause power sharing from other utilities to attempt to supply additional power. As the demands become greater a cascade or domino effect first predicted during the Y2K scare could cause the entire grid to crash, largely due to its continuously failing infrastructure.

      Preparing for Total Grid Failure
      Welcome to the 19th century. That will essentially be the lifestyle for everyone following a long-duration, national grid failure. Homesteading will be the new normal, and self-reliance the only solution in a society with few manufactured resources, no easily accessible drinking water, few food sources, rare medical care, and few options for communication.

      Water
      You can’t live 3 days without water. Without the grid, water will become scarce, especially if you depend on a well pump. Even municipal water towers will soon run dry as the pumps that refill them sit idle without power.

      Food
      We mentioned it once. 90% of the U.S. population is projected to die during the first year of a national grid failure mostly due to starvation

      https://urbansurvivalsite.com/reasons-power-grid-could-fail/

  14. Probably an EeeVee plugged into a 120V outlet would be limited to 15 amps, or 1,800 watts.

    So an upper limit on daily consumption would be 1.8 kW x 24 hrs = 43 kWh per day

    Then plug in the utility’s price per kWh: if it’s $0.15 per kWh, then the daily maximum increment to your electric bill due to the EeeVee would be 43 kWh x $0.15 = $6.45 per day

    If those EeeVees were plugged in for half the month. then the maximum increment to your power bill would be 15 days x $6.45/day = $96.75.

    The $170 monthly increase cited by Eric implies that EeeVees were plugged in 24/7 for 26 days of the month (assuming 15 cents per kilowatt-hour is about right).

    Makes me suspect that other loads were added during the cold weather. For instance, I use a portable electric heater in winter for 4-6 hours per day. It adds about $50 a month, compared to summer electric bills.

    • Jim,
      20 amps can run off a 110 outlet, if it’s wired for it, and the breaker is 20 amp. Which would not be unusual in a garage. So 26 days turns into 19.5 days, or 18 hours per day. Which is likely in the range of what is required to keep an EV running.
      Eric heats with wood too, so in my experience, the only added load would be for his refrigerator, because the house is TOO warm. Even if he doesn’t use the wood heat, the only added expense should be running the fan on his propane furnace.
      I’ve found that instead of running a portable electric heater, turning on an incandescent light bulb lamp will increase the perceived temperature a couple of degrees. Using one right now as I write this. Toasty.
      If you review Eric’s articles, you might notice that he kept them plugged in pretty much all the time they weren’t running, and STILL failed to gain much if any in the process.

      • But John you’re forgeting the lawyer’s vote. Sure the engineer can get an extr 5 amps out by assuming a 20A circuit, but then they’d have to trust that the owner is smart enough to know what a 20A NEC outlet looks like, then trust that they aren’t going to just get an adapter (or just twist the hot prong) to make the pokey bits fit.

        • Amazon reviewer Jean W:

          ‘My 2017 Bolt will charge with this cord at 8 amp or 12 amp based on car setting. If your circuit at electric box is 15 amp – charge at 8 amp. Don’t do 12 amp unless a 20 amp circuit. I’m learning.’

          Oh boy — fun with circuitry. Learn as you go! Easier than building a Heathkit.

          Hope this experimenting doesn’t produce any casualties.

        • The lawyer’s would REALLY have a problem with my suicide cord I suspect. I have a nice Honda Inverter generator (converted to natural gas – so I just plug in a hose and can run for days), but it is only 120V. So I use the suicide cord to connect one leg to the other inside the house (and turn off all 240V breakers).

          I do have a proper inlet plug and breaker interlock for the gen, and all my refrigeration, freezers, furnace, and mostly used lights are on the generator leg. So at least the lineman are safe…

          Good luck powering your house with a generator when they switch to all electric furnaces.

      • ’20 amps can run off a 110 outlet, if it’s wired for it, and the breaker is 20 amp.’ — John Kable

        Apparently 16-amp 120V chargers are common. Here’s one on Amazon:

        https://www.amazon.com/Lectron-Level-Charger-Extension-UL-Certified/dp/B08HHBDQ88

        Customer Fred D states in a review, ‘I measured the current draw at 15.7 amps, or just above the current rating for the 15 amp sockets commonly found in most houses and garages. To use this unit, you really should have a 20 amp socket.’

        Totally concur, Fred — you really should. But incredibly, the user manual (linked in the Amazon listing) says NOTHING about verifying whether it’s a 15 or 20-amp circuit. Apparently, they are just depending on the breaker to trip if an uninformed user overloads a 15-amp circuit.

        Sounds a little irresponsible to me. But the manufacturer is in China, like so many of Amazon’s suppliers. So good luck on serving them with a product liability suit if you burn your garage down. Sheesh!

        • So it appears the consensus is that increasing the charging capacity in your garage is dangerous, and might burn down your garage, and EVs are perfectly capable of doing the same thing all by themselves, any reasonable risk reward evaluation can only end in “NO”.

  15. Thats pretty outrageous. I wouldn’t go to the store, load up my cart, walk out without knowing the price of things. Trusting the controlling authority would bill me later, at a fair and honest price. Even with 5$ a gallon gas I can decide how much I want to pay beforehand.

    I think it is a feature, not a bug of the Eee Vee types. From what I’ve seen they live far above their means, paying anything just to be a part of the current thing.

  16. The ineluctable conclusion is Eric is a busy cat out there in the world.

    Drives all kinds of cars and trucks to test and review.

    All right there in front of you to see.

    Car enthusiasts all over the world read the content.

    You read hundreds of comments, make one comment, then keep reading some more.

    Can’t do any of it with no electricity and no computer. You’ll be driven to distraction.

    The number one usable energy is electricity. Good to have all of the time, comes in handy for lights and some heat. When it is gone from time to time, you miss it right away. The grinding wheel stops turning. Everything changes in one second when the power is not there.

    People want electricity, in India, the spaghetti wires hanging from power poles all over the place is the proof in the pudding. The power company can move electricity to every customer. The customers are happy to have electricity, hands down.

    Gov workers drive around in cars with big speakers on the roofs urging people to pay their electricity bills. It is organized chaos.

    Every single city all across the world has electricity, high demand for electricity no matter where you go. Doubtful any will go completely dark.

  17. Most people view electricity as “free” since they since they sign up for paperless billing from the utility company and, in most cases, grant permission to have the monthly bill deducted from their bank accounts.

    A lot of mischief has crept into the system since people stopped writing checks for their essential services needed to live. Even the grocery stores accept credit cards.

  18. So what happens to a EV battery if it is left alone for some time and the self-powered battery heater/cooler then depletes the onboard battery? No more heat/cool. What happens to the battery then?

    • The industry term is that it gets “bricked”- AKA turned into an expensive paperweight. It can happen in just one power cycle of these exotic battery technologies. And I know of a guy who let his Tesla go dead, it was a very bad experience- car was dead and couldn’t be recharged.

      • So wealthy people own EV’s, and wealthy people usually own many home. Which means when they park the EV in NY for the winter while they are somewhere else, when they get back, the thing has to be ‘bricked’. Guess they just don’t care and go get another one?

  19. Well we had a rolling blackout in my neck of Dixie a couple weeks ago due to the extreme cold. Never happened before. TVA and Alabama Power issued all kinds of excuses. None of which included forced shuttering coal fired power plants. In other words they couldn’t keep up with the demand. Total guess here –maybe less than 1% own EVs here. If EVs are forced upon an unwilling populace, the recent rolling blackout would be a happy memory.

    • I saw a lot of EVs in Nashville this Summer while visiting Tennessee, and I imagine there are quite a few up in Clarksville in the hands of military people at Fort Campbell who never seem to lack for cash to pay for high end vehicles.

      Doesn’t TVA also service the northern suburbs of Atlanta? Game Over up there.

  20. ‘the utility company does not line-item what it cost to power/charge up individual devices’ — eric

    A $28 plug-in Kill-o-Watt meter will tell you how many kWh were consumed by a fridge, a washer (but not a 240V dryer), or an EeeVee plugged into a 120V outlet in the garage.

    Definitely recommended for your next EeeVee test, to confirm the exact cost of slow-charging at home.

    Presumably a smart 240V charger would have power monitoring built in.

    But to your main point, the claim that EeeVees are much cheaper to operate than ICE vehicles is evaporating like a morning mist, as electric utilities aggressively hike rates.

    What else are quasi-monopolies going to do, when they’ve got captive suckers … errr, customers … to exploit?

    • Right Jim,
      The PTB keep glossing over the inconvenient truth that electricity is not freeeeee! My current rate is about 22 cents/kwh…….before the 25% price increase coming next month; my natural gas bill is going up a similar amount. These WEF bastards are hell bent on sending us – not themselves of course – back to the stone age. Now would be a great time for a tactical nuke to land on Davos.

      • ‘If you have one of the dreaded smart meters your utility may have a near realtime monitoring page on their web site.’ — ReadyKilowatt

        Here is the hourly resolution the utility captures from my meter, and emails weekly:

        https://ibb.co/dGJZ50Y

        The spike at noon coincided with washing and drying a load of clothes.

        Doubt they know that, though, as these are not web-connected smart appliances.

        • Jim,

          Smart appliances could be the next thing that the Biden Thing and globalist technocrats try to shove down the masses’ throats. They’ve made it clear that they want TOTAL, PERPETUAL power over the masses.

        • I typically see huge spikes when running the electric dryer, microwave, range and surprisingly, the electric kettle. The “baseload” usually pulses with the refrigerator cycling on and off, the boiler circulator pump and that’s about it. My network stack does have a pretty big draw, but it also helps keep the office warm. Either way, on net the solar panels make much more electricity than I use.

  21. It’s all a lie. We don’t need them, we can’t afford them, and they don’t work. And of course the “reason” for them is a lie too. The result of computer models that are set up to produce the desired effect. An effect that always fails to materialize. Otherwise the entire Florida peninsula would be under water, and there would be no Arctic or Antarctic ice caps. Hence the name change from “global warming” to “climate change”.

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