An EV Experience

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It’s hard making use of a battery powered device when it’s hard to keep it charged up. That – rather than the range – is the true (and not-likely-to-be-solved) problem with battery powered devices.

That is, with electric vehicles.

Which are devices. They differ from other devices in that they have to move under their own power, as opposed to a device such as a phone that you carry with you or a laptop that sits on the table. In order to be able to move under their own power, they have to carry it along with them. This takes a very large – and very heavy – battery. Which, of course, takes more power to move it (and you). And that is chiefly why electric vehicles don’t go very far before they run out of power.

But that is not their true limitation. Motorcycles don’t go very far, either. But it is easy to put gas in one, almost anywhere (almost anytime) in two or three minutes. If you ride, you’ll already know all about it. A stop to refuel takes only a little longer than waiting for a long red light.

With a device, it’s not only that the wait is often longer than it takes to get where you were going (in the 30 minutes it takes to partially charge an EV at a “fast” charger, I can drive all the way into town or back) it is often the case that you can’t charge the device.

Either at the “fast” charger or at home. In which case, you might not make it back home. Or dare not risk leaving home – because running out of charge for a device is not like running out of gas. You can’t push three tons of device down the road. And you can’t walk back to the device you left by the side of the road with a can of kilowatts. So you had better always have enough charge to get there and back – plus a margin, for just in case you can’t get a charge.

I had this experience recently in a new device I was test driving. The company that delivers and picks up the vehicles I test drive asked me to please be sure to have the device charged up enough on pick-up day for the driver to be able to drive it at least to the next place to charge it. So I plugged the device in – to my garage’s 120V “Level 1” (common household) outlet on a Tuesday, figuring that by Thursday – pick-up day – the device would have enough charge for the driver to be able to get to the next charger.

But when I checked on the device the following morning, it had not charged at all. Some issue with the charge box thing that is supplied with every EV. It is not just a simple plug with a cord. It is a doohickey that acts as an interface between your outlet and the EV that has to “boot up” properly before it will facilitate the charging process. You don’t just plug in your device. You have to make sure your device is plugged in and that it is actually charging.

My device wasn’t.

So now it’s the day before the driver comes to pick the device up – and the device says it only has about 82 miles of driving range left. Which isn’t very far – or much margin. Keep in mind that point about running out of charge vs. running out of gas.

Given how long it takes to recover any significant charge at home – using a “Level 1” outlet (“Level II” – which is 240 volts, is faster but the problem there is that you have to have the right type of plug to plug in, which varies according to the device you have) I decided to risk the 30 mile drive into town (and back) where there are some “Level III” so-called “fast” chargers where one can recover a partial (80 percent) charge in about 30-60 minutes, depending on the brand of “fast” charger.

But when you get to the “fast” charger, you may not be able to get a charge – because the charger is “out of service.”

This almost never happens with gas stations and even when it does, there’s almost always another gas station not too far away. And when you get to it, the pump nozzle will fit your car’s filler neck. Because all gas pumps have the same type/diameter nozzles.

EV “fast” chargers are EV-specific.

More finely, they are EV brand specific. If you own a device not made by Tesla, your device’s charge receptacle and the “fast” charger’s male end may not mate. In my case, the next-down-the-road “fast” charger was for Rivian devices only and not for BMW devices. So I could not get a charge there, either.

And now I was down to about 60 miles of charge remaining – with the guy coming to pick up the device the next morning. By the time I got home, the device had almost no charge at all remaining – about 31 miles indicated. Had I not been able to get the car’s factory-supplied charge box to “boot up,” I would not have been able to charge the device up sufficiently for the driver to be able to drive it to a “fast” charger. The press fleet management company would have to send a flatbed to haul the device to the charger.

Will this is problem ever be solved? Probably not.

While it’s possible to make a battery with more capacity, the problem of recovering that capacity in anything less than a long time – in comparison with how little time it takes to refill a tank – will persist. Because charging a device is not like filling a tank. It is one thing to pump liquid fuel into an empty container; it is another to draw electricity into a battery. You need more than a high-volume pump. You need an as-yet-undeveloped technology.

Maybe it will be developed, in time. But the fact is it’s not available – and may never be.

The sum of it is that charging a device takes planning, time – and good luck. If any one of the three doesn’t line up, you may find yourself out of luck.

. . .

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53 COMMENTS

  1. Hey Eric!

    I heard this on VPN/NPR today (was forced to listen to rather),

    https://www.reddit.com/r/electricvehicles/comments/1cni1jb/hertz_charges_tesla_model_3_renter_277_fee_for/

    I guess when you rent an EV and bring it back with low charge, they charge you for “gas”, at the rate of a vehicle returned late fee, which is one days rental cost, plus the actuaries of not being able to loan it out for someone elses trip. Of course a slow charge can bring it up past 80% which is how they probablly rent them out, but what about the inconvienience of a trip to disneyland being a roadtrip of nothing but range anxiety.

    I ramble on but there’s a point in there somewhere to do with they should full well expect the customer to bring it back empty for EV’s. Why would I rent something and spend the entire time looking for chargers? If you can’t bring it back low then there better be a public fast charger that works right next to the rent-a-car else this is a racket.

    • If you can’t bring it back low then there better be a public fast charger that works right next to the rent-a-car else this is a racket.

      Fast chargers don’t exist. They haven’t been invented yet, and are not commercially available for installation. That’s why there are no fast chargers nearby, no matter where you are. In fact, there is not a single public fast charger available in the entire US.

      Level III chargers, on the other hand, do exist, but they are not fast chargers, as they have a rather abysmal charging performance, although not quite as abysmal as level II chargers. In your scenario, the presence of level III chargers would probably help, although charging would be anything but fast.

      • Good morning, Stufo!

        Yup. Imagine being on a business trip – or on vacation – and having to budget even 30 minutes into your schedule to wait at a “fast” charger to top off your rented device before dropping it off prior to catching your flight back home. This assumes the “fast” charger is working – and that the app on your phone is working. That there’s no one else already plugged in. That the time it takes isn’t variable.

        Yeah. I ‘ll sign up for that – when I could have just rented a car that I can pump full at the last minute, almost anywhere – and make my flight with time to spare.

        • Rental cars are about the most stupid thing to be EV’s. You are in a city you may not be familiar with, so getting it charged would be a major pain in the ass. I for one will refuse any electric car if I have to rent a car.

          But I am taking my own car on vacation this summer. It’s 1100 miles to Florida, so I am going to enjoy the road trip as part of it, as those will likely not be possible in the future if elites get their way.

    • Nazi Propaganda Radio (((NPR)))?

      Reminds me of the eye opening quote from my Chinese friends…”All Government is bad!”

      To wit, some (((government’s))) are even worse!!!
      As in, insanely evil, like USFEDGOV…

  2. Electric vehicles existed in the 1830’s. EV’s were a thing 190 years ago.

    Along came the internal combustion engine, gasoline made the engine go. Electric went away, but not gone nor forgotten.

    Car Questions Answered at YouTube does give a real perspective of the auto world and how cars are bought and sold.

    A 2014 Dodge Charger sold at auction for 8,600 dollars at a dealer auction.

    A Nissan Leaf 2014 model year sold for 1800 dollars, and finally caught a bid at 1200 dollars. 3000 dollars was the beginning ask, then to 2500, then to 2000, then to 1500, then down to 1200 USD.

    If you can, buy a Dodge Charger or Challenger, they are collectible right now. For 26,000 dollars or so, you will have a gem of a car.

    On June 1st, Stellantis’ CEO will wander into the mist, gone to the retirement gig.

  3. “The company that delivers and picks up the vehicles I test drive asked me to please be sure to have the device charged up enough on pick-up day for the driver to be able to drive it at least to the next place to charge it.”

    Has that delivery company made this request previously regarding charging test vehicles ?

    If so, disregard my paranoia.

    If not, I agree with your gut feeling sumpins up. Your reviews are after all, honest. Be careful.

  4. Build it and they will . . .

    Chop the f’n cables off for the copper!

    https://www.kiro7.com/news/local/copper-thieves-have-new-target-electric-vehicle-charging-stations/635DX4LIGVASVOLWBKKAJBUUAY/

    Another knee slapper, typical PNW libtard thinking in the article:

    “I feel like that’s just a symptom of a bigger problem,” said Maddie Fives, Seattle, “which, like, sucks because electric cars should have a place to charge. But we should do something about the people who need money and food and housing.”

  5. Nobody wants EV semi trucks……

    installation of on-site charging facilities taking years.

    From ZH comments….

    Imagine a local LTL terminal that operates 100 trucks doing “last mile” deliveries to end customers. (I picked this number because it’s big enough for some economy of scale, plus it’s part of a regional or national carrier that has enough revenue and employees to be listened to by governments and bankers.)

    It’s also a nearly ideal situation for en electric truck, which would be much less of an impediment to local deliveries, because they could be charged all night while your drivers were at home sleeping.

    Still, the electrical service to charge 100 rigs simultaneously would probably require a dedicated substation. Then, imagine wiring up your own transformers and 100 chargers across a huge parking lot.

    After spending the millions it would take to do that, you still have to buy the trucks.

    Then you have to pay the electric bill.

    Or you could just install a 5000 gallon diesel tank in your yard and have it filled three times a week. You could pay for that in perpetuity with the interest on the capital it would take to go electric.

    Next problem….the amount of fuel burnt back at the power station…. to produce the electricity to charge the trucks….. is far greater then the amount of fuel burnt using diesel engines to power the trucks….plus the cost of using diesel is lower then the electrical bill…and will get far worse as electricity prices rise….

    and…the EV trucks cost 3 times more then diesel powered trucks…. and have far more maintenance and repairs…plus nobody knows how to fix them…..lol….

    …..Battery-electric trucks are about three times more expensive than diesel rigs, the Journal notes…

    https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/economics-just-dont-work-demand-electric-semis-plunges-due-high-costs

  6. More EV charging problems….

    Seven different charging networks….you need seven different apps..

    To use the charger you have to have the correct app….the next problem is… it is frequently difficult to get the app to even work …..

    Next problem…you can not pay cash…. ever….

    • Apps…

      It is interesting that everything is through an app on a cellphone now….

      A $1200 tracking device that you almost have to have now….

      Charge your EV?…you need a cellphone without a dead battery…battery dead…-35 degrees out…you might die…

      Get into your EV?…one Tesla owner panicked…his cellphone battery died so he couldn’t get into his car…if it was -35 degrees outside…he might die….

      Buy food?….now it isn’t cash or card… it is now payment by cash…(soon to be banned)….watch or phone…phone dead…. cutoff, etc…no food for you….

      Soon….An internet connection is required or you starve….

      Herd them into 15 min/city camps…no mobility….cut off their food…all dead in 3 weeks…problem solved….slave herd too big….

      • Herd them into 15 min/city camps…no mobility….cut off their food…starve them….

        Survival…..

        In the early wind sailing days, the ships would often run short of food and crews would resort to trapping and eating the rats… in the O’Brian books, they referred to rats as ‘millers’ because they were often dusty from the flour bins when caught.

        Give a rat a fluffy tail and furry ears and it’s a cute squirrel. Same recipes apply.

  7. Jimi Hendrix on range anxiety:

    Every day in the week, I’m in a different city
    If I charge too long, the people try to pull me down
    They talk about me like a dog, trash my lack of range to spare
    But they don’t realize they’re the ones who’s square

    — Jimi Hendrix, Stone Free

  8. Back in the 70’s during the manufactured gas “shortages” I kept a couple five gallon containers of gas in the trunk of my car. Not the saaaafest thing to do but they were well secured so as not to slide around or tip over, and kept me at ease knowing I had lots of “range” available in case I needed gas on a day when my plate didn’t match whatever the fatwa was at the time (odd or even number). Guess that would be equivalent to towing an extra 2,000 pound battery behind your EV, a Great Leap Forward indeed 😆.

  9. Not that I advocate for it, but has the SAE taken on the task of standardizing the electrical connections? I hope not bc I’d like to see eeeveees die on the vine.

    • Not like a gas nozzle, but yes there is a standard. And then there’s Tesla’s standard. And some cars don’t use all the pins available to all the plugs. And not all plugs have all the pins that some cars have. But the physical plug is standardized (except for Tesla, which requires adapters).

      This becomes an issue where there are two grades of chargers at the commercial charging sites. Because the higher end cars typically can accept a DC fast charging option, with two different current ratings, the owners generally look for this option. But the lower end vehicles can also use this plug, but they don’t take advantage of the higher rate charging, so if there’s only a few pylons that have the DC fast charge (because there may not be enough capacity from the power company, or because the operator didn’t want to waste money installing the much more expensive pylons that require active cooling of the power cable, at all the spots), and a Bolt or Leaf grabs them, well, your Taycan is just going to have to deal with the slower charge rate.

      I believe the term is “regression towards mediocrity”

      • Because the higher end cars typically can accept a DC fast charging option

        Fast charging is never an option, because fast chargers do not exist.

        • Who said they did?

          https://chargehub.com/en/electric-car-charging-guide.html

          Just wait for the BREAKING NEWS report that someone wired up their own charging cable, it didn’t work so they bypassed the “the charge box thing that is supplied with every EV” Eric spoke of in the article. This is more like an in-line circuit breaker that tells the vehicle’s charger how much current it believes it should be able to draw, based on loop resistance and other factors. It also makes sure not to whack the current too quickly just in case the 20A breaker is a little soft and pops too easily. We used to run into that problem with cable system power supplies that were on the edge of overload. If the batteries ran down and the current draw was over design spec, a weak breaker would trip after the power came back on. We’d try to get high magnetic breakers, but the warehouse would just send whatever was on the shelf. So off to the local electric supplier and add a little OT to your timesheet for the good ones.

          Anyway, just wait for the story that someone energized their car and electrocuted themselves with a reversed hot and neutral connection. “Better leave that stuff to the professionals,” said Chet Blowdrigh.

  10. Warning: Government has always and will always stifle civilizations advancement. IF governments during the 17th and 18th centuries were like governments are today we would not be enjoying our trains, planes, automobiles, and appliances. The necessary equipment and products would not be available. Gunpowder,,, gas etc would be banned for the lowly citizens.
    A man in New York has just been jailed for ten years manufacturing his own guns for his personal use. Government in its zest to disarm everyone ( and oh my god! safety) would have not allowed individuals the necessary tools and products to invent anything in use today. We are now regressing and will continue to regress because governemnt is frightened to death of the individual and his/her ability to invent given the opportunity.
    This society will never advance, new great products will not be forth coming due to the smothering actions of GovCo and our crazed demand for safety. Only the beloved approved corporations and their slavish employees will be allowed to venture where no man has ventured before and even they will have limitations.
    With People of severely limited intelligence occupying government overseeing the great unwashed Mankind will never see the greatness that God envisioned,,, only wars, Wars, and more WARS until governments manage to destroy all life.

  11. Isn’t it curious that while nearly all other “high tech” devices are sold on their “convenience”, EVs offer none?
    Would you buy a cell phone or a laptop that spent more time charging than it did operating? Or left you stranded if its battery ran out, and must be recharged for several hours at home, or at a fast charger that may not work?
    There’s something deeply wrong with this picture.

    • Another fundamental difference is that cell phones and laptops are still usable while they are being charged, while EVs are not. EVs spend most of their time being 2.5+ tonne paperweights.

  12. It is scientific illiteracy that is responsible for the (limited) “success” of EVs today–until these same scientific illiterates find out about extended charging times and limited range. Basic scientific principles are not taught in schools, being replaced by “touchy-feely” environmentalism and how humans are destroying the planet (yeah, right).
    It is my humble opinion that us boomers are of the last generation who took science and technology seriously, with a hunger to know how and why things work. Us boomers had electrical and mechanical systems that we could work on and improve on ourselves. Basic scientific principles were taught in school and reinforced with hands-on experimentation.
    In today’s climate (and the climate of two previous generations) experimentation on the level of the 1950s and 1960s is seen as “too dangerous”. I can remember the chemistry sets of the day being sold with toxic compounds which could be used for nefarious (and fun) purposes. Such sets are banned today.
    Today’s prime example of the public’s scientific stupidity being pushed by political considerations is that of electric vehicles, most people (even supposedly “educated” types) enthusiastically jumping on the bandwagon despite the major deficiencies and problems these vehicles have.
    Let’s look at the technical side of electric vehicles vs. ICE (internal combustion engine) vehicles. Range is a large factor in the desirability of ICE vehicles vs. today’s electric vehicles. One can fuel up an ICE vehicle in approximately five minutes and be on his way.
    Not so for electric vehicles. Quite often electric vehicle charging stations are few and far between, which contributes to “range anxiety”. For short hops and city driving, electric vehicles can be an ideal solution, but for extended “road trips” forget it.
    Electric vehicle batteries lose power even when the vehicle is not in use. (This is akin to a gasoline vehicle with a leaky gas tank). Add to that, cold weather and the use of accessories (air conditioning, heat, lights, etc) will reduce range considerably. Electric vehicles may be somewhat suitable for a California climate, but will fail in sub-zero Michigan winter snow and ice.
    Batteries can be charged only to 80% of full capacity as overcharging will reduce battery life considerably. “Fast charging” is also detrimental to battery life. It’s all about time and convenience vs. battery life.
    Gasoline and diesel fuel has an large energy content (density) in a small package, something that, in their present stages of development, electrical vehicles cannot achieve.
    Let’s make a comparison…gasoline contains approximately 33.7 kwh per gallon. A gallon of gasoline weighs approximately 6.1 lbs. The typical ICE vehicle can hold about 15 gallons of gasoline with a weight of approximately 90 lbs. total, with a total energy content of approximately 500 kwh.
    High-end electric vehicles have an energy capacity of approximately 120 kwh. This is equal to less than four gallons of gasoline. The typical electric vehicle has a 75 kwh battery pack, equivalent to approximately 2 ½ gallons of gasoline.
    Keep in mind that the battery pack weight is well over 2000 lbs (1 ton) and still has a limited energy capacity compared to gasoline. The typical electric vehicles weighs approximately 2 ½ tons (5000 lbs.), having to haul around a heavy battery pack. This also contributes to “wear and tear” on other automotive systems such as brakes and tires. (Yes, I am aware that regenerative braking exists and is a part of electric vehicle technology).
    From an environmental standpoint, lithium is nasty stuff, reacts with water violently and is much more volatile than gasoline. Electric vehicle accidents are much more hazardous than those of ICE vehicles. Water cannot be used to put out a lithium battery pack fire.
    Yes, gasoline is dangerous, but we have learned to control it and live with it successfully for over 100 years.
    Most of today’s generation do not understand basic scientific principles; hence the enthusiasm for electric vehicles which are “not yet ready for prime-time”. The inability of today’s generation to understand basic scientific and engineering principles is responsible for their gullibility and ignorance.

    • “ Basic scientific principles are not taught in schools, being replaced by “touchy-feely” environmentalism “

      Oh how true this is. Most of my basic knowledge was 5th grade in ‘65/‘66. CO2 to O relationship via plant life, weather systems why it rains on one side of the mountains and dry on the other, the ice age cycles, how electricity is generated and distributed.

      I was lucky to have rational teachers 3rd, 4th, 5th grades then saddled with a young female nut job 6th grade teacher that was a wasted year.

      The theme in much of that mid sixties education was better living thru science, what a perversion modern education has become today. Real science replaced with “climate cult” idiocy, evil hydro dams killing off the sacred fish, etc.

      Also the “tinkering” in a garage or basement workshop gaining more practical knowledge for a lifetime. Don’t have to be a PHd in materials science but some real facts knowledge and mechanical skills keeps you out of the P T Barnum “sucker born every minute” camp.

    • “It is my humble opinion that us boomers are of the last generation who took science and technology seriously, with a hunger to know how and why things work.”

      I keep seeing this comment copy pasted.

      Just plain dumb. Does the comment or seriously think Boomers are the only generation to have understood science? Sad.

  13. Let’s not forget that EVs “leak” even when not being used. This is akin to an ICE vehicle with a leaky gas tank.

  14. If there was the demand, and thus money to be made, EV chargers would be everywhere.
    Since there isn’t, the demand isn’t there.

    Production precedes consumption. Production will only occur when someone has discovered there will be a demand for what is produced. This hasn’t happened with EV charging.

    No amount of government dictates will change this.

    • Yes and no. The 400V lines required for a full size charging station might require a lot of upgrades. Can’t just tap into an HV distribution line if it’s already maxed out with existing customers. The “Goldilocks” locations where the capacity exists and there’s enough traffic to attract users are probably pretty well taken by Tesla Superchargers by now. So power companies need to engineer solutions, pull new cable, activate new transformers and install meters. Hopefully they’ll put the demarc where you want it, at a price you can pay. And that’s before pulling construction permits from the “you want to build what now? Another gas station?” planning commission.

      Then once you get the lines run and the permit, now you have to find an electrician certified for commercial work. They’re always pretty busy, so better plan way out, like months away for activation. And running HV lines ain’t like dustin’ crops boy. There’s an entirely different set of rules because of physics and safety. Much of this is probably already included in the equipment manufacturer’s bid, but if there’s change orders, which are somewhat common for big projects that haven’t been done before, well, that’s more time lost and more engineers and more cost. Meanwhile your line of credit is burning up 8% interest and you haven’t connected a single vehicle.

      Not really a big deal, that’s entrepreneurial risk after all. But too many delays and payback starts to slide. Even with generous subsidies (which require a lot of high dollar manpower to get, in the form of accountants and business managers and sometimes lawyers). There’s still a ton of money out there up front, considering even the subsidy isn’t a direct handout, usually showing up on the tax bill or way out after the fact. Are you and your investors willing to wait it out? Even when Tesla is renting out dead mall parking lots and airfields to park inventory?

      • What will be happen and has already happened in a few places. A charging station powered by a (big) diesel generator……..

  15. Imagine if there weren’t many gasoline stations around. You’d probably need to have a fuel tank onsite, much like many farms have red diesel delivered. When you ventured out you might have a list of gas stations, but you won’t know the status of them, if they’ll have the right hose for your vehicle, or if the database is up to date. Maybe you’ll get there and the owner decides to gouge the travelers just because he knows he has you over a barrel.

    80% of the trips you take, everything works as planned. The daily trudge off to the salt mine, the weekly trip to the Food King, and running the kids around for all their extracurricular activities, that works fine using the fuel tank at home.

    When the in-laws come for a visit, well, might as well refuel their car too, even though they “forgot” to offer up a few bucks to cover the cost. Family harmony comes at a cost. And the divorce’ neighbor, well, her discount delivery guy was running late so could you help out, just this one time?

    When faced with this dilemma, you might get a little upset. You might blame the manufacturer of the vehicle, or the salesman who made big promises and brushed off your concerns about refueling …maybe he even “helped” you purchase a fuel tank and have it installed in your home. Eventually enough people would complain to get the attention of politicians, who, smelling votes, would offer to subsidize tanks for the poor, or filling stations in areas that are more “fair” and otherwise unprofitable for businessmen. Which would be many, given that most of the refueling activity takes place at home, not at a central business. There’s no scale, unless you can make refueling away from home the more attractive alternative. In the case of gasoline, that’s probably not all that difficult. Having to maintain a tank full of explosive liquid (ok the vapor is the explody part, but you know what I’m talking about) that makes a mess if there’s a leak, and takes a while to transfer to the tank Those Veeder-Root pumps can move fuel very quickly, much faster than a hand pump for sure. Then again, if the default is home refueling that engineer who came up with the high volume delivery pump might have done something else for a living.

    The point being that the transportation fuels delivery system wasn’t built in a 4 year presidential term, and certainly didn’t have the massive headwinds that a useful EV charging network is facing. The idea that someone can just conger an EV charging network into place overnight, at the scale required to service every vehicle on Earth, is insane. Especially when 80% of the time users won’t need it. Even Musk figured this out, which I think is why he’s laying off all the Supercharger network people and opening it up for other manufacturers (with an adapter, but this has been enough blabbering for one comment).

    • Building an EV charging network is one thing, having the necessary technology to make the chargers needed for such a network is another.

      Unfortunately, fast chargers have not been invented yet (and there are indications that they never will be), which means that any EV charging network that is built, no matter its scale and coverage, would be fundamentally flawed and unfit for purpose due to the abysmal performance of its slow chargers. (And if that wasn’t bad enough, there’s also the issue of where the electricity should come from.)

      • Yup, another huge problem. No one is adding substantial new electric generation anywhere in the western world. For sure not in the US of A!

        Of course nobody reports that. Well, outside of places like Eric’s auto!

        They report nonsense like this:
        https://www.canarymedia.com/articles/clean-energy/chart-nearly-all-new-us-power-plants-built-in-2024-will-be-clean-energy#:

        They claim that 96% of new power generation coming online in 2024 will be carbon free and “green”. For some reason 23% of that is battery storage, which of course isn’t generation. Batteries do not produce power. Not one volt. But yet it’s included in the 62.8 GW total.

        62.8 GW sounds like a lot, but keep in mind how many (mostly coal plants) are closing (some of them decades earlier than planned). And that the 23% number attributed to batteries are in fact NOT generation but merely storage). So it could be barely equaling out what is going off line (probably forever, unless they are mothballed, which most aren’t) in 2024. The 2% of new nuclear (the first new build from the ground up nuclear plant in 30+ years) is two units of a single plant in Georgia. Which may not actually come online in 2024 due to many delays due to regulators.

        In the case of my local electric company (NIPSCO), they would like to take offline ALL of their coal plants by 2030. The problem is, 75+% of the power they produce today is made with coal plants. That means they want to replace 75% of their generation in a mere 5 years, let alone add any new capacity.

        In the 1970’s and early 1980’s they failed twice trying to build nuclear plants that cost billions but never made a single watt of electric (they are still paying for those nukes they never got). Now they think they will replace 75% of their capacity in under a half decade. Good luck (granted they are now backtracking on the 2030 date). They plan on buying must of that power on the open market (good luck with that too) from third parties!! Never mind the waste of the perfectly good coal plants, some of which was originally planned to last into the 2060’s and 70’s!!!!!

        We better get used to the idea of brownouts and blackouts. Because they will be happening even without a bunch of stupid electric vehicles being put on the grid…..

  16. EV’s are brought to you by the Visionary Class. They’ve been pushing the rope of progress since the Progressive Era. They also specialize in hubris and arrogance. their motto is Onward Through the Fog!

  17. BEVs are a technological dead end. That’s why they ended up on the scrap heap of automotive history a century ago, and that’s where they’re headed once again (unless, of course, the powers that be intervene and force us to buy them).

    • Exactly Stufo. The reason humanity ALWAYS has to repeat history is that we refuse to believe things were done before. Everything is brand new donchaknow? Nothing like this has ever been done before! That’s why people walk around with face diapers and take bioweapon shots for a common cold – as if 1918 never happened.

      • Just as there is no Covid there was no Spanish flu. Same as today,,, supposed vaccines were the culprit. Today the PCR tool invented by Kary Mullis is use to scare the bejesus out of People by misusing the tool as a sort of diagnostic test. They’re doing it again with the Bird flu.

        Apparently fool me once, your fault — fool me twice my fault no longer applies.

      • Some of the Bakers have about the same range as todays “state of the art” new EV’s. Some progress……not. In fact the Bakers batteries actually lasted longer and were less dangerous than today’s. Maybe Tesla should name one of their toys a Baker……

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