Clovers are ok with the American Police State because to them, it’s not a police state. They see no imposition – much less tyranny. They see “democracy,” lawful order. The flag – and (to them) freedom. The mindset is nicely articulated by the well-worn Clover cliche: “If you just obey the law you won’t have any problems.”
It’s circular reasoning, obviously – with the circles becoming ever tighter as they spiral down toward the drain into outright and abject slavery. Which even then, Clover will not see as slavery. He will still be free to act, he thinks – provided of course that he acts within the boundaries laid down for him. In the same way a slave was free to pick cotton; or the medieval serf free to farm his small plot… so long as he gave his Lord the specified portion of his crop.
Clover does not grasp that each time he submits, he has surrendered a piece of his life. And much worse, the lives of others, too.
Eventually, there will be nothing left to surrender.
But this ugly inevitability does not trouble Clover. He agrees to allow others to direct and control his life, to make his decisions for him. And because he has accepted this “direction,” so also must others. If they do not, if they object in any way, then they deserve what comes to them.
It will please Clover to see them punished.
Unfortunately, Clover’s psychological S&M routine is not his private perversion – which incidentally would be ok, in a free society. If he likes being told what to do – and punished when he does not do as he’s told – he has every right to live that dynamic provided it’s just between him and his dominatrix. What’s not ok – if society is to be free – is Clover’s demand that everyone else don the Gimp suit and rubber ball in the mouth, accept the lash and say “yes, Mistress” (that is, yes, Officer) on cue.
Yet this is precisely what Clover does in fact demand. And it’s the reason why Clover gets absolutely furious when they do not comply.
The other day, my wife went to the post office in one of our trucks. I had peeled off the old (out of date) state “safety” inspection because I figured this would be less conspicuous to any passing costumed enforcer. My wife encountered a Clover instead. She parked in front of the post office, and as she was exiting the vehicle, an angry little man lectured her about the absence of the “safety” sticker on the truck. Since he had to waste his time and money on a “safety” inspection, it infuriated him to see someone else who had not yet submitted. Rather than be angry with the Police State and its minions, he had become a minion himself.
We see this kind of thing all over nowadays. Most recently in the tattle-tale campaigns of the Department of Heimat Sicherheitsdeinst that counsel, “If you see something, say something.” For example, there’s the case of Brian Loftus. He went to a local gun store and bought several boxes of ammunition for target shooting. Still legal in this land of the allegedly free. Except, someone “saw something” – and “said something.” Which led to Loftus being telephoned and interrogated by the state police. (See here for the story and a video of Loftus.) In Cloverstan – er, America – there is no problem. Loftus should accept that the state police police were just “trying to keep us safe.” Clover cannot fathom the man’s anger; in fact, it makes Clover angry that anyone would get angry about such a thing.
After all, if he had nothing to hide… .
Similarly, the also-recent case of a sixteen-year-old student who got a visit from FBI thugs because of the pro Ron Paul (and police state critical) video he had put together for his high school government class. “We need to talk to your son,” the FBI thugs intoned when the kid’s mother answered the doorbell. They then tried to intimidate the kid into becoming an informant. To infiltrate – and rat out – online groups and individuals that seem to have an “anti-government” (that is, pro-liberty) attitude. He declined. (See here for that story.)
On the road, Clover goes ballistic when someone else declines to obey “the law” – not because of any objective danger, but because they have declined to obey. It drives them absolutely out of their minds. Check CVS Ad on WeeklyAds2. And the assertion that it’s not any “danger” represented by the law-ignorers, but rather the fact that they have dared to ignore the law, that enrages the Clover is clearly backed-up by the classic example of the Clover who uses his car to prevent another car from passing. Though the Clover reviles “speeders,” he himself will speed – in order to thwart a passing attempt by another driver. He will use his car to block other cars – deliberately, recklessly. Because he cannot stand the idea that anyone might violate the law he worships in the same way that a jungle savage worships a shrunken head.
Clovers at the airport get upset when a traveler dares to assert his fourth amendment rights. Clovers manned the camps in Germany and Soviet Russia, in Cambodia and Cuba. And they will man them here, too.
Clover cannot abide outliers, people who prefer to live their own lives (and leave others free to live theirs). It is exactly like the medieval church and its anathemas and burnings at the stake; its insistence upon absolute catholicism – and utter submission. Any deviation from the orthodoxy cannot be tolerated – not because the “deviant” seeks to deconstruct the hierarchical coercive collectivism of the institution – but merely because he wishes to be free of it. Which amounts to the same thing. Because if someone is allowed to be free – to go in peace – then potentially, everyone may go in peace.
And that simply cannot be tolerated.
Clover knows it – and will literally kill to prevent it.
Cloverism represents humanity’s Dark Ages – an atavistic (perhaps stunted is the better word) intellectual-moral mindset that lingers still, despite the surface trappings of modernity, technology and civilization – and which always threatens to return humanity to a literal Dark Age.
If enough of us allow that to happen.
Throw it in the Woods?
[…] do we claim the power to impose our desires by force over someone who has harmed no one? Do we embrace aggressive violence against peaceful people or […]
Good article. Everything written there is on the money.
The reason this agenda is being so vigorously and viciously prosecuted in the United States is because we are the ONLY remaining large population of unconquered people on the planet, though that is changing rapidly now.
The so-called “elites”, the globalists, want a single central government reigning over the entire planet. In some ways it has its appeal, in theory. In reality, of course, this will be a cluster-copulation the likes of which humanity has yet to experience. Europe is conquered, as is most of the western hemisphere. Australia has clearly been brought to heel and Africa is a disaster. Asia is conquered as well. India is compliant, and therefore poses no threat to the design for world dominion. The Arab world, and perhaps more broadly that of Islam seems to be something of a wild-card still, but I suspect that the innumerable hordes of pig ignorant people in those regions are perhaps manageable.
Americans, however, still stand their middle fingers in numbers far too great to be tolerated, especially in this era of instant communication. The world sees what we do and if we are allowed the natural prosperity that is part and parcel with proper freedom, the rest of the world will no longer accept the shackles of one-world-slavery. The elites cannot afford to tolerate this and therefore the Americans must not only be subdued, but completely destroyed as a freedom-minded species. It is not enough to take away all we have; it is our THOUGHTS that must be eradicated – our attitudes toward self-reliance, our entrepreneurial bent that runs deeply in our veins that must be purged so that we might cease to serve as an example to the oppressed peoples of the world of what CAN be when tyranny is swept aside. No sir, and make no mistake about this: we MUST be eliminated if “they” have any hope of attaining their goal of global conquest.
And what a job they have done, thus far. I do believe that a simple majority now exists, composed of clover and his many clones, that have been successfully lead to believe in the righteousness of forced collectivism and to openly hate anyone not on board with the agenda. The tools employed to accomplish this once seemingly impossible task have been deceptively simple, yet their efficacy cannot be denied. Notions such as “social justice”, that capitalism is evil, that equality means equal outcomes for all, class hatred and bitter envy, as well of a host of others have been applied to such devastating effect as to boggle the mind. And the ever expanding clover population has eaten it up with ever greater avarice and venom toward any who stand outside of their ignorant political opinions. Those who are of a different bent are now within the outermost boundaries of actual physical danger at the hands of clover-supported tyrants. The gravity of this situation would be difficult to overstate.
As for those who say they want to leave, I tell you that it is the worst decision you could make. This disease of globalism will follow you no matter where you go. At the rate at which things are now progressing, in 20 years there will not be a crack between two floor boards into which you will be able to crawl where “they” will not find you and impress upon you their wills.
Stay and fight. Please. Be brave – hard as hell to do, but running scared will buy you only short time. These people need to be stopped and by any means necessary because if we do not stop them, not only are we all screwed, but so is our posterity. Ask yourself, those of you with children, what do you want to leave for them and their children? Is this it? I surely hope not.
Hi osan. This is one of the greatest posts ever. Thank you for your thoughtful and incisive analysis.
I am one of those who intends to leave this country. At age 61, I believe there are places where I can live out the rest of my life in relative peace. By the time the OWG takes hold in the backwater that we (me and my soon-to-be wife…just 104 days to the wedding) intend to move to, I will be at eternal rest.
You raise a more difficult question regarding children. My two daughters intend to leave this country for Asia in the next few years. I tend to think that OWG will not really get hold of many of the countries there…it will be a primarily Western phenomenon. I’m betting that all of the different cultures with billions of people will ultimately prevent the OWG folks from realizing their plans. Thus, I feel comfortable with my decision to flee the Fourth Reich.
What happens if reincarnation is the order of life? What then?
First of all, congratulations on your pending wedding.
As regards leaving, I see nothing to gain there, but to each his own. But as to your assertion that Asia will not be part of the global government, I cannot agree. It is already part of it, I suspect. Even so, look at China; a more treacherous band of viciously brutal murderers the world has yet to find. Whether they align with the one-world globalists makes no difference to those who suffer under Chinese authoritarian tyranny.
As for me, I will stay and do what I can to be a thorn in the side of our domestic tyrants.
Well-written and very convincing, Osan, thanks.
I’ve said the same; the Elites want to utterly destroy America, her people, and the very ideas on which it (was) based…because they cannot tolerate any beacon of hope in the bleak world they’re creating.
Look at how much more they’ve worked on America than, say, already-captive Europe:
* GMO foods that are “stacked” with traits far beyond their stated purpose (herbicide resistance, pesticide production)–infertility, tumors, gut disorders
* Fluoride–originally used by the Soviets, then the Nazis, to induce an apathetic placidity in prison camp populations
* Massive propaganda–much more so than Europe, although funding our propaganda does help elsewhere as we export movies and TV
* Drugs, drugs, and more drugs–legal and illegal, we use three times as much as the next biggest drug-using European population
The Europeans don’t have GMO’s or fluoride. They don’t need to use those means anymore; they’re captives already.
And I tend to agree that it’s better to stay and fight here…because the NWO will be everywhere if we lose here. Then where will we go with our kids?
Still–I entertain notions of leaving, living out the NWO wars in peace in the southern hemisphere, and perhaps returning.
Because they WILL be defeated. It will just be a hellish interlude.
Sorry forgot to mention vaccines–carefully engineered immune-destroying, brain-poisoning, cancer-causing bioweapons.
Overstated? No, understated. If anyone has any doubt on the above three statements, research it. Vaccines are a key part of the NWO play.
Or do you think the government’s pushing them from its own magnanimity and care for you?
Speaking of bioweapons: How about food that is designed to be worthless as food, yet make you feel hungry? This what processed and GMO “foods” do. People become obese, lethargic – and eventually, seriously ill. This serves the double-whammy purpose of keeping them docile and profitable.
Amen Eric. My lawyer friend calls it “Slave Chow”; foods designed to make you fat, stupid, complacent, infertile, impotent, and docile.
Oh and sick and weak, too.
With a little cancer thrown in to suck you dry through the government-medical industrial complex, and kill you before you start drawing social security.
Yep, there’s a reason Monsanto is in bed with government.
I’ve just read up on a book called “Wheat Belly” and it, along with my transitioning toward a more primal diet, only reinforces my belief that the whole chain of life, from birth, education, food, medicine, insurance, and ultimately death, is a racket.
Just as true 8 years ago. Methylamine can add a 4th bullet point; “control”.
There comes a time in a sheep’s life when he let’s go of the fairytale of The Good Shepherd. He doesnt have to shout about it to everyone from an ivory tower, but rather whisper to those few whose ears are ready to hear.
The shepherd is using you for your wool, and meat. Govts keep the flocks of 7 billion in a pasture of lies. The grass is similarly green most places. Stop following them to the slaughter is not a surprise when it happens a billion times in a row.
Fucking bleating heart idiots. There are no black sheep who deserve slaughter. Stop letting them pull your own wool over your eyes. There is no Little Lambsy Divey. Stop eating the GMO ivy and run away to the resistance where we can dye your wool camoflage and give you a fighting chance as a free sentient mammal.
As I said, it was on at approximately 2:25 PM CDT today, 29 September 2012. I posted shortly after hearing it. I couldn’t believe that I heard it properly until they came on after the quick break to commercial advertisements and a caller made a quick reference to how “professional” they were in that they didn’t crack up in dealing with such a caller.
It was so well done that it might appear on the net by some way of recording it even if the radio station doesn’t provide a show recording.
What got me to listen to the background noise of the radio show was the creepy show hosts taking her moronic lead in so seriously, and these are supposed to be “car people”.
I am not at all conveying just how funny and well done was the jobbing of new car sellers in actively being suckered by the old cranky lady.
Unfortunately it seems that that All About Cars presented by ADAMM is not available via podcast.
I had a radio car show going as background noise and a clover caller came on. It was a 60’ish woman that prattled on and on about how she must have the safest car possible. The auto dealer hosts welcome her to come in on Monday and she would get her ultra-safe car. She then asked moronic questions about what can be added to her braking systems. This was getting really interesting in a perverse sort of way as she is the poster beast for clovers.
The kicker was when she finally blurted out that her present car’s brake pedal feel gets hard like a swelling cock. I couldn’t believe that it got past their radio delay, but there it was.
Kudos to the fake clover lady for ridiculing the safety fanatics.
It was on WTMJ radio at about 2:25 CDT if they have a show recording. I don’t see it here:http://www.620wtmj.com/podcasts
What program was it? What date and time?
Thanks in advance.
“hard like a swelling cock”
We have to find that sound bite!
Did anybody hear about the man from Clover? Sure sounds like a nice place to live…NOT!!! Basically a bunch of clovers who have obviously decided to name their town after themselves are prosecuting this old man for the heinous crime of having too much “junk” in the yard of the house he owns. I can’t help but feel bad for the old guy, but what an ironic place for events such as this to be unfolding.
Sad – and did you catch this part in the story”
“because in Clover, rules are rules …”
Holy smokes! Clovers living in place called Clover. I feel like we live in the United States of Clovers.
Response to Michael on art: You are kind imho. I think purchasing fine modern art is a means by which criminals establish themselves on the social register and purchase their “civilized” credentials. I think the art world is run by the Mob, is good way to launder money & until it is written in the New York Times no Clover will ever cop to it. There. I said the ugly truth from my POV. Over & out.
The perfect Socialist Utopia is a prison. Always.
TRUE SO far that’s for sure. 1917 Russia freed millions of feudal serfd initially. It all goes to hell because you have to pay the finance pmts on your utopia.
By 1789 america was way worse off because of all the destroyed wealth and legbreakers the new republic couldn’t cover the juice on.Goodbye confederate sovereins. Hello federal constitutio enslavement.
The EU was began by Robert Schuman as a coal and steel cartel. Munitions were closely monitored and it did work to bring europe lasting peace thru economic slavery and no national soverignity.
NOW NOTHING THERE IS EVEN VOTED ON. Its rammed thru lisbon treaty style behind closed doors.
Eu people get to vote on where to hold their football tournament and eurovision song contest.
Obama is a technocrat building africa unions and american unions behind closed doors.
Nothing is real that comes from chicago. Oprah jerry springer. We,re all reality show fakers forced to pretend we really are the lies are fathers told before us.
I don’t buy this lake wobegon flim flam. Even lew and eric have to answer to koch or the moonies or whoever.
I and my kids are not above average and neither is anyone else.
6 months ago I drove so drunk I don’t even remember parking all sideways and going into work to sleep it off where my family wouldn’t see.
Since then I renewed my protocol and came clean to my partners in crime so it doesn’t happen again.
Statistically these things will occur. So does infidelity and little white frauds.
Let’s cut the crap on this whole rotten fairytale Pete Brimelow is right. America has been hijacked by minorities. Including those who only pretend to be upstanding and moral automatons. Moral majority my ass.
Dirty Harry is on the right track. Democrats and republicans supranational nato un and eu. They’re all filled with strawmen and belligerent liars. Nothing but empty chairs.
Erik, your observations are on the money. Though I currently hold precious little hope for the state of human liberty in the USA, much much less anywhere else, I believe in pressing on regardless. What other choice is there? Lay down and die for the masters? To hell with that and to hell with them.
Government has no authority. Why? Because it does not exist per sé. Therefore, how can anything that does not exist, save as a concept within the skulls of humans, have authority over a human being? If one protests with the premise with the trite and clapped out old saw that “the people” are “government”, they actually torpedo themselves even more severely because, A. they acknowledge that government has no existence apart from the human beings who hold the notion in their minds, and B. rights are not additive. That is to say, the rights of a group does not outweigh the rights of the individual. If we accept the premise of equal rights, then no man anywhere on the planet may exercise mastery over another man without consent. That is to say, no man holds an iota of authority over another. And let us be clear that FORCE is not authority. It is only force.
My fondest hope is that we’re at the end of the beginning of a new Reformation–and THIS time, what we’re overthrowing is the notion of authoritarianism, not just the authority of a particular institution.
Although I’d settle for it if people just awakened from the nightmare of government authoritarianism.
This Reformation is about questioning the State as an institution, just as the one in the 1500’s was about questioning the Catholic church’s beliefs…and authority.
Finally, I see traffic laws as common respect for others. I don’t care about speeding. Speed all you want. I don’t care so much about parking either. But when a driver’s actions affect me, that’s when I get upset. Would all of you just blindly accept someone cutting in line in front of you at the grocery checkout when you’ve been waiting patiently? You don’t think fairness plays in there? It’s the same thing with road construction. I absolutely despise the cheaters running to the front of a lane closure! How is wanting people to wait their turn Clover behavior?
As for the “law breakers” I saw it first hand driving home one night. My family (wife and 3 kids under 5) were in the car. This little chick comes speeding up the Interstate, weaving in and out of traffic at probably 90 to 100 mph. Well, she made one weave too quickly and her wheels turned right underneath the trailer of an 18 wheeler. It just about caused a massive pile up and my family would have been in the accident. You think I’m a “Clover” for wanting that idiot to actually follow some traffic laws so that my family can survive the drive home?!?
Look, I’m no fan of the government either, but obeying some common sense traffic laws makes it better for everyone. Or am I misunderstanding the intent on Clovers? Someone please explain the “cool kids” response to the situations I’ve outlined.
The situation you’ve described – the chick driving 100 MPH and almost losing control of her car – is (obviously) an example of reckless driving. But a Clover equates what you’ve described with anyone who “speeds” – which of course is nonsense. Driving 80, 90 even 100 mph (or faster) under certain conditions may be (and often is) reasonable. It depends on the situation, the road, conditions, and of course, the driver.
Conversely, driving the speed limit in certain conditions (or if the driver can’t handle that speed) can be much more likely to result in an accident. If the driver’s addled, incompetent or reckless.
It’s not speed, per se.
The Clover sees only “the law” – and more, demands everyone be forced to abide by arbitrary, dumbed-down standards.
So a clover is similar to Javert (from Les Miserablés) who mindlessly follows the law regardless if it makes sense or is just.
Excellent book. Some decent movies.
Inspector Javert is more of an uber Clover. Standard-issue Clovers simply cheer him on!
“Finally, I see traffic laws as common respect for others.”
That’s reasonable. Unfortunately, countless traffic laws are completely unreasonable.
No right on red – even when it’s obvious there’s no cross traffic coming and it’s safe to proceed.
Cops waiting in the bushes at deserted intersections, ready to ticket any driver who doesn’t come to a full stop – even though (again) it’s clear there’s no cross traffic and thus no need to stop completely.
Mandatory “buckle up ” laws.
Unreasonably low speed limits (the old 55 MPH highway limit being the textbook case).
The absence of sufficient legal passing zones; the requirement that one may not exceed the speed limit to pass a slow-poke.
Note that none of these laws proscribe conduct that is intrinsically unsafe or dangerous to anyone. They are merely statutory offenses – technical fouls, I like to call them.
Most of us at one time or another have been given a ticket for one of these “offenses” – or one like the ones mentioned. Most of us feel aggrieved when we’re ticketed for such things, too – which is telling. Most of us would not feel put-upon if prosecuted for a theft we knew we’d committed, or because we’d beaten someone up. The fact that we do feel aggrieved when ticketed is a natural response to an unjust hassle.
Hi Eric. I very nearly violated a meaningless traffic law Saturday night. On my way home about 1 a.m. Stopped for a red left turn arrow, with visibility at least a quarter of a mile in all directions. There wasn’t another car in sight. Normally, having ascertained that it was safe, I would have made my turn and proceeded on my merry way. Luckily, my internal bacon sensor must have been on high alert…something didn’t feel right, so I waited a minute or so for the arrow to turn green.
Sure enough, after making the turn I saw a county sheriff’s car parked in the shadows. Now, if I had turned on red and he had ticketed me, that would have been chicken crap, as there would have been no danger to anyone. But I would still have had to pay the piper for not showing sufficient respect for authoritahhhh.
Exactly, Mike –
I think most of us have been there/done that – which is why I find it so startling that so many people still respect “the law” – despite clear evidence that “the law” is often just arbitrary BS, an excuse to screw with people and take their money.
Thanks for the response. This makes more sense. I agree that the senseless laws are irritating. I was driving through what was essentially a parking lot entrance when a police officer turned around to cite me for a seat belt. I was going no more that 20 mph. No need for a seat belt. I was in the vehicle for less than 2 minutes.
It’s sort of like getting a DUI when you’re just SITTING in the @#$@ car! I mean, I’ve heard of people trying to sleep it off before they drove home and still got cited. Ridiculous.
Didn’t it infuriate you to be robbed at gunpoint by that costumed thug? Because that’s exactly what he is – and exactly what he did. What sort of creature (I won’t use the honorific, man) sees you doing what you were doing and then uses his authoritay to fuck with you like that – over something that is none of his god-damned business?
I literally would not lift a finger to help such a creature if I came across it later burning to death in its car.
I’m going to meditate on that image for a while, Eric.
The speed limits and the men with guns have been around for how long now? Exactly how did they prevent this? It happened, so they didn’t prevent it. It’s quite possible we are seeing a consequence of a system of dumbing down.
When the 55mph NMSL caused a break down of lane discipline, Joan Claybrook (or someone similar if my memory is off) is quoted as saying that by forcing faster drivers to weave through this made them go slower and thus made the roads… -safer-. So, when someone weaves through traffic at 100mph, remember, that’s by design of the queen clovers who broke lane discipline intentionally.
BrentP, what you said about weaving through traffic at high speeds made me think of a POSITIVE experience I had two Sundays ago, and how great it is to be NOT a Clover!
I had gone up to a town in the mountains about a two hour’s drive from the giant megalopolis where I live and saw that the town had an immense number of motorcycle riders up there, having lunch out on the various outdoor patios among the trees, enjoying the sunshine, the fresh mountain air, and the good company of each other. I found out from my waitress at the place where I went to eat that this is a pretty usual thing for Sunday up there. It’s a great biker haven and, of course, they truly enjoy riding on the mountain road up there and back.
Even for me in a car it is a thrilling drive back down out of the mountain. The road seems to be banked just right on all the curves, the vistas are amazing, and I feel that it is pretty safe to drive that highway at least ten miles per hour over the posted speed limit, if not more…and I have done so.
Something else good about that highway is that they have pretty frequent turn-out or “slow driver” passing lanes, which are especially helpful for going in the direction UP the mountain, as there are ALWAYS the slow drivers that you have to pass, which you cannot do safely with all those curves. Unless I am passing somebody, I almost always move over into the slow lane, myself, because in addition to there always being people who are slow, there are also always those who want to go faster than I do, so I automatically let them go by if they want to. It is, of course, none of my business to impose my own speed limit onto others.
Now, on my way back down the mountain, there were quite a few motorcyclists coming down behind me, and every single one of them was going way, way faster than I was–they were all FLYING! The numbers of them coming down behind me were at a frequency greater than the number of official turn-out lanes, so that even if I politely used every one of those turn-out lanes, these bikers would have to slow down behind me and have the pleasure of their trip frustratingly diminished.
However, I saw that this highway also had almost all the way down it a kind of half or maybe quarter-size paved portion over to the right of it, just wide enough for me to slide over onto IT, which would leave enough room for a motorcycle to whip on past me without having to slow down a whit, and this didn’t even make ME slow down, either.
I could easily see a motorcycle coming on down behind me far enough back that I could time my sliding over in perfect harmony with his speed and in enough time that he could see that I was intentionally moving over for him so that so he could pass me without even having to think about braking. It became a beautiful kind of “dance” flowing down that highway, and it was thrilling enough that I wished I were filming it all with a GoPro camera! I experience this at least thirty times, me moving over, the motorcycle overtaking me and zooming by on the curve, me moving back into the lane, having another motorcycle approach, me moving over, him passing me, and so on. I actually felt like I was part of their ride! And every single one of them, after they had successfully passed me, held their fist up in a kind of “thank you salute” that made me feel very, very good.
Experiencing them like that made me think that I, too, would enjoy being on motorcycle like them–something that’s been on my mind for a while and that experience strengthened it–it was very much of a feeling of “I want to be like THAT!”. And it was during that drive down that I realized that a great and supportive community to become part of, especially if (when) the shit hits the fan, would be motorcyclists just like that. What other kind of person more clearly shows how freedom-loving they are, and, I am going to bet, who are also self-sufficient and interested in personal sovereignty enough to NOT be easily tread upon. I think they serve as a great example.
Those people (Clovers?”) who are afraid of bikers just haven’t experienced them personally. For my money, as an overall group (excepting something like the Hells Angels, maybe), few are more generous and helpful. I realized then that there is a huge difference between an “outlaw” and a “criminal”. And what we are talking about here is outlaws, which I think is a good thing.
Me and my buddies went on a ride Sunday (it’s a ritual). Meet at the Waffle House at 8, eat, get gas and go. We all have big cc cruiser bikes and we roll. Think we did a bit over 200 miles through the mountains of West Virginia. It is the most awesome fun ever! I suggest getting a big cruiser style bike with bags!
I’ll take the bag on the right. 😉
In some countries, some roads have a wide shoulder that can be used by traffic to provide room for faster traffic to pass.
Great post, Tom!
And – get ready to be jealous – what you describe I get to do every day (just about) because I live in just such a place.
But, to your point: Bikers – mostly – are as you describe. I think it’s a function of the type of person who becomes a biker. And, of course, the fact that it takes a lot more skill to ride a bike than it does to drive a car. Thus, you get a better class of person, insofar as road manners are concerned.
I second Dom: Join us!
Having/riding a bike is one of the greatest things in life. It is a huge stress-reliever and great fun – in addition to being practical. Bikes – even big bikes like Dom rides – get better gas mileage than most any car. Some – like my middleweight touring bike – get better mileage than almost any hybrid car. And it’s not necessary to spend a lot of money on the bike itself, either. As little as $3k or so (less, even) can buy you a mechanically sound, cosmetically presentable bike.
If you’ve never ridden before, I recommend looking into the Motorcycle Safety Foundation new rider course. There is almost certainly one in your area. You can learn to ride without having to buy a bike or gear – just pay the (small) fee and learn to ride using the bikes and gear they provide, in the safety of a high school parking lot. Then you can decide what sort of bike you’d like to buy.
I’d personally recommend something along the lines of a middleweight “standard” like a Honda Nighthawk 750 or Suzuki SV for your first bike. Such a bike is big enough that you won’t outgrow it or feel silly riding it after six months. You’ll also have no trouble selling such a bike for about what you paid, too – when the time comes to get something else.
I would recommend against a sport bike, or a big touring/cruiser bike (like Dom’s) for your first bike. Sport bikes are too much, too soon. Those who have never ridden one before literally can’t imagine what it’s like to be in the saddle of a bike that can do 0-60 in 3 seconds (or less) and run a 10 second (or faster) quarter mile. It is very, very easy to get in trouble – killed or badly hurt – on such a bike, if you haven’t got the experience to safely control one. Big heavy cruisers like Dom’s also require skill and experience to operate safely. These are powerful bikes that can weigh close to 1,000 lbs. – and that weight (and power) can easily get away from you, too.
Nothing ruins the fun like wrecking – and getting hurt.
If you’d like some more in-depth recommendations about specific bikes to consider for a firs-time rider, just ask! I and others here will be happy to give you our thoughts!
Thank you for your great response, and advice about motorcycling, Eric. Yes, I am envious! I definitely intend to take a safety course and I see one being taught very near me every weekend. It’s pretty popular, too, quite a lot of people of all ages seem to be there.
Also, so far, I had no idea where to begin, what size of motorcycle, and so on, so I appreciate your idea of the middleweight and for sure I’m not interested in starting out with one that, as you said, could go from 0-60 in three seconds!
Price-wise, and mileage-wise, it seems almost stupid to NOT do it, but, of course, a guy has to know what he is doing. It looks like for that amount of fun, this is very cost-effective.
I may be asking some questions here!
You bet, Tom!
I bet the class you saw was the MSF class I mentioned. See here: http://online2.msf-usa.org/msf/Default.aspx (click on “rider course,” top menu bar).
You may want to consider a dual-sport motorcycle such as the Kawasaki KLR250/650, or the Suzuki DR series, for a first bike. A “dual-sport” is a motorcycle setup for mostly street driving but which can be ridden off road, too. These bikes have a number of virtues:
* Very easy to ride; the engines are not peaky nor too powerful (or too weak).
* You can learn to ride on the grass/dirt – as opposed to the street (and asphalt).
* They’re made to be dropped (being built for off-road use). So you won’t do much, if any, cosmetic damage to the bike if you drop it (on the grass/dirt).
* You have the capability to explore dirt trails, go almost anywhere (lots of fun!)
* Bulletproof: The KLR series has been in production, largely unchanged, for 20-plus years. These are single cylinder bikes (both the 250 and the 650) and known to be all-but-unkillable. Cheap to keep.
* Abundant/inexpensive to buy. See above. There are thousands and thousands of them out there; you should have no problem finding a very nice (great mechanical shape, low miles) 650 for $4k or less.
* Excellent gas mileage. A 250 will usually give you at least 70 MPG with street tires.
Here’s some info: http://www.motorcyclespecs.co.za/model/kawasaki/kawasaki_klr250%2002.htm
If you prefer a street-only bike, I recommend the Honda Nighthawk series. Especially the 750. It’s a nice-looking, capable (and extremely reliable/easy to maintain) bike that’s ideal for new riders, but not a bike the new rider will outgrow in six months. Many experienced riders ride Nighthawks – because the bike is just a damn good do-it-all bike. It’s considered a “standard” bike, but if you wanted to, you can add a windscreen and bags and turn it into a touring bike. Lots of accessories available. It’s also pretty sporty as it is.
Here’s some info:
One more. Why is it bad for me to back my car into a parking space? Why is that “Clover” behavior? Sometimes, if no one is around and waiting to park, I just back it in. I either have to back out when I leave or back in when I park. What is the difference if I go ahead and put that step in when I first park instead of when I leave?
Some people can not backup in an efficient manner. It takes an inordinate amount of time to backup when it should not take more than 20 seconds if performed properly.
Here is one extreme case of incompetence.
I have to admit, I have a bit of Clover in me about traffic laws. But let me explain. It’s not that I get mad at people for not obeying the laws, it’s that their disobedience is a dis-respect to me. I’m obeying the law and not running up the right hand side breakdown lane to get where I’m going. But invariably, these A_H-OLES all run up the right side and then cause my lane to slow down waiting for all those people at the front of the line. If people would just be respectful, traffic would flow a little more smoothly instead of waiting for all the cheaters to cut in front of the line during lane closures. Where am I wrong in this sentiment?
Objecting to cheaters – people who do as you describe, driving on the shoulder, then cutting in front of people to get to the front of the line – isn’t Cloverish at all.
But backing in to parking spots? That’s Cloverish if you’re impeding others, making them wait as you maneuver.
If no one’s waiting on you, then no problem!
Good to know. I’m interested to learn more of what is and isn’t Clover behavior then.
Hi Johnny. Another problem with people using the breakdown lane is that emergency vehicles sometimes need to use it. I vaguely recall a case in northern Virgina, probably in the early 80s, where someone had a heart attack and crashed on I-395. In the resulting backup, people used the breakdown lane to try and get ahead of other cars. It turned out that the ambulance couldn’t get to the guy in time and he died.
On the other hand, I see nothing wrong with using the breakdown lane if you are getting off at the next exit and can see that the lane is clear that far ahead. Using the lane in that case gets you there faster without harming or even inconveniencing anyone.
In the past I blocked shoulder passers. Once I got so sick of it I pulled on to the shoulder completely turned on my hazards and just sat there. The reason being is that they just forced themselves in up ahead. Countless times I’ve had shoulder passers want me to let them in… after they had passed me. Um no. Some got angry.
When it comes to the traffic law I find clovers violate all the time. It is clovers who attack me when I am bicycling more often than any other group. Why? They have this handed down version of the law but they’ve never read it. They feel I don’t get to use the road and if I do I have to always yield to them. That I should drive a car (for every trip) like everyone else. They believe that the law is to be socially enforced on bad people.
I’ve had clovers nearly cause a collision when they ran stop signs. What do they do? They accuse me of ‘speeding’. Even when I am riding a bicycle. They don’t follow keep right except to pass laws. They do X over the speed limit, where X is their personal opinion, which if they were ticketed for they would be angry.
If you do something a clover did to you, to them, they often get angry. The law doesn’t matter. It’s not a technical thing with them, it’s a social one.
Don’t make me say shit about riding a motorcycle among the glovers….O M G.
In Missouri, and I imagine many other states, one could not be promoted to eighth grade without passing a standardized test on the Constitution of the United States. Years ago this requirement was dropped and teaching of the Constitution was deemed unnecessary. The schools have since served the state by failing to inform the populace of their rights and the limits of government power. How can we now expect any outcry over abuse of power from those who never knew government power was once defined and limited?
The seeds of the clover fields were sewn long ago.
Police State, yet another violation of our rights. The gov’t constantly violates our rights.
They violate the 1st Amendment by caging protesters and banning books like “America Deceived II”.
They violate the 4th and 5th Amendment by allowing TSA to grope you.
They violate the entire Constitution by starting undeclared wars.
Impeach Obama, support Ron Paul.
Last link of “America Deceived II” before it is completely banned:
Not a clover, and yet I too sometimes will speed up to keep people from passing, but:
If you’re on a two lane road, with distinctly different lane-speeds, keeping your av. speed up makes you ride in the left, even if you normally keep right.
There will always be some red-light barnstormer, who will try to pass right, only to jump into the front-gap I’M keeping for safety and to avoid braking as much as possible.
Or what about the a-holes who insist upon passing you at +0.5mph, thus jamming you into the back end of a clover, and so, making me brake?
So, speeding up in these cases is a pre-clover-action prevention.
And clover think is one of the main reasons drugs are illegal:
some of them actually DO MAKE one able to stop thinking in that way, they help break the conditioning we all receive, and can allow us to start perceiving things differently.
Some clovers have realized that too, and are thus opposed, wouldn’t want any one to be able to choose between the colored pills.
It all begins with religion, and the desire to be part of a group. Prayer circles, obedience to dogma, following rituals, all designed for the comfort of not having to experience the scary world on your own. The worship of the secular state has replaced god for most modern people, though they rarely see it.
Don’t forget fuuuuhhhhhhhttttball.
Paul and Eric, this scribbler explains the purpose
of religion in the last two posts on this page:
Religions begin by codifing rules for preventing
violence and hardships in communities, then
those rules – over time – are sanctified by the
idea of an unseen, all-powerfull judge ( deity )
–given power in community through tradition
and ritual passed down through generations,
each of which adds to or subtracts from
those codified/sanctified beliefs; that is,
religions are an attempt to keep peace and
prosperity in societies–to corral the power
of the reptilian brain in each of us (( read my
above-linked posts )), which unparalelled
savagery had been unleashed by godless
Stalin, Lenin, Hitler (practiced a godless
paganism), Chairman Mao, and Pol Pot.
In other words, give me a religion-steeped
ruler over an atheistic one!, as the latter
has no moral restraints but his/her own
whim about what’s right or wrong (( the
phenomena of ghosts, out-of-body
experiences and other occult experiences
contribute to the rise of religious beliefs )).
“If you just obey the law you won’t have any problems.”
I typically respond to this with the “First they came…” statement from German pastor Martin Niemöller.
“First they came for the communists,
and I didn’t speak out because I wasn’t a communist.
Then they came for the socialists,
and I didn’t speak out because I wasn’t a socialist.
Then they came for the trade unionists,
and I didn’t speak out because I wasn’t a trade unionist.
Then they came for me,
and there was no one left to speak for me.”
The crime for which he was arrested is quoted as “not being enthusiastic enough about the Nazi movement.” When government is free to make the laws, this statement simply does not hold up. Especially disturbing is the proposed expatriation prevention legislation acting on an ex post facto basis, trashing yet another clause of the Constitution.
This from Milton Meyer’s “They thought they were free”, The Germans, 1933-1945.
More Americans should read Meyer’s account and note the striking similarity of present day American attitudes to that of the Germans from 1933 to 1945.
This reminds me of a story of poetic justice I once heard, that happened in Britain. Someone did that very thing – and a few weeks later got a summons for obstructing the police, because the car he had blocked like that was actually an unmarked police car in pursuit of a suspect.
I once had a Clover I was attempting to pass cross the double yellow and move into the opposite lane of traffic to prevent me from passing. But I’m the “dangerous speeder”….
Thats good GW,never thought of it that way,anyway I’m apalled at the lack of respect for the intellegent common man(I think Frank Baum had it right in Oz)-Kevin
As far as I know, none of the belligerent powers murdered diplomats during the WWII era. It strikes me as a rather stupid thing to do.
Technically, no –
But a Nazi diplomat in Paris was assassinated by a young Jew furious about Kristallnacht. And Reichsprotecktor Reinhard Heydrich was knocked off by Czech partisans.
Heydrich responded to being attacked quite courageously, proving that bad people are not all cowards.
When I was a little kid “The bigger they are the harder they fall.” was a popular saying. I disabused myself of that myth when I discovered that the bigger they are the harder they hit.
Fortunately, most big guys seem to be good natured.
Certainly. Heydrich was one of the few higher echelon Nazis who lived up to the billing. An accomplished, intelligent – and physically courageous person. Hitler was no coward, either. But physical bravery doesn’t mean moral courage – or even good morals.
I agree on most big guys being good-natured. And the obverse: Small guys are often mean little SOBs!
The Napoleon complex at work.
The diplomat just might have been a good person. Consider manufacturer Shindler, and the Japanese diplomat who used their office to save numerous individuals from the very governments that employed them.
Intrestingly, one of the most overlooked historic events is the Trial of the Judges* that followed the War Crimes Trials at Nuremberg. I think about it often when I consider what juris doctors and career office holders are doing to America.
*JUDGMENT AT NUREMBERG is a surprisingly good movie.
That’s true – and if so, I feel bad for him and his family.
I wasn’t really going after him personally, of course. I was just expressing that I understand why he was killed – and that the Libyans were not attacking because “they hate our freedoms.” They hate us. Rather, they hate the US government ans its vicious, duplicitous polices. I can’t reproach them for this. I’d feel the same if I were on the receiving end. Hell, we are on the receiving end. So it’s very easy to empathize with the fury of these abused, dispossessed people.
I can relate to frustration. The lives of those Americans who support unlawful power mean nothing to me.
More than two years ago Congressman Ron Paul said FOR THE RECORD that the Drug War is UNCONSTITUTIONAL. Why have both Congress and the Media not responded? The lot of them should be tarred and feathered. To be aware of a crime and to do nothing is itself a crime.
It’s time to return to the Basics found in the unamendable Unanimous Declaration.
I have heard that it became quite notorious that people often did not make it back from parties in the country organised by the German Embassy in Sweden during that war. And, of course, right after that period the Zionists often assassinated diplomats (Lord Moyne, Count Bernadotte…).
I ran across this sticker website today, and I thought this sticker was so freakin funny…I can’t stop laughing about it.
Very pertinent to this post. http://www.libertystickers.com/product/Crouch-down-and-lick-the-hand-that-feeds-you/
Those are AWESOME!
I like this one:
You could’ve supported Ron Paul. Now we’re completely fucked.
But my favorite is one I think I’ve mentioned here before. I was approaching a Volvo in traffic and saw the Obama circle (BTW based on the Illuminati eye)…and I thought “Christ, typical, a Volvo-driving Obamanoid”
Until I got closer and read it:
Obama: The Quicker Fucker Upper!
I’m not sure quite why, but the one I saw that made most nervous was one I saw when I was motorcycling in England many years ago. Displayed in the back window of a car, in wavery handwriting, was a sign that read: “Warning, Belgian disabled driver”.
Damn, typo. “… that made me most nervous …”.
Here’s something to give you guys (and girls) some encouragement:
There’s an effect I’ve talked about before but not explained. It’s called the “Tipping Point Effect”; it shows that if only 10% of a social network holds an unshakeable belief, in very short order the belief becomes the dominant ideal of the network.
Here’s a summary of the study.
Remember, one of the founding fathers when asked about the Revolution said “The Revolutionary War? No that wasn’t the Revolution. The Revolution happened in the decade before the War; it was a foregone conclusion by then.”
(I paraphrased because I’m too impatient to find the actual quote sorry)
I think we are in the late beginnings of the next Reformation! From 1492 to 1503, Pope Alexander VI essentially ruled the world. He was horrible, unspeakable psychopath who whored out his own daughter for political favor…and bedded her himself. And he was merely the tip of a pyramid of corruption and decadence…just like government today.
By the end of that century, the tide had shifted and we were launching into new freedoms never anticipated in the thousand years before!
History repeats. And the cycles are a lot shorter the further it goes, it seems. So THIS Reformation might happen in our lifetimes!
What I fear is the destructive power the sociopaths have today. These are the kind of people that kill people and destroy things they can’t ‘have’. The revolution of thought may come, be the world might get wrecked in an attempt to stop it.
Don’t fret BrentP. This is the same group of sociopaths whose fancy and menacing technology can’t even control third world countries armed with light weapons for any length of time.
Sure – they can kill people, even lots of people, but that even makes the larger majority not in power that much more determined to fight back. The worst enemy to have is one who has nothing to lose. Those ordering the bombings seem to forget this relatively simple concept all to often.
This business in Libya is encouraging in that respect. It shows that Uncle can be kicked in the balls.
Methinks the swarthy savages just don’t like White Folks.
LOL “Uncle kicked in the balls”
Michael–can you draw a mock-up of those old stern-looking posters of Uncle Sam that looked like a skinny Col. Sanders pointing at you and saying “Uncle Sam needs YOU!”…doubled over after getting a good shot in the batteries?
Now THAT’S a screensaver, avatar, and background I’d use!
@TGSam–swarthy or not, if say China came to Texas and did to us what we did to Libya…I’d think of some really creative treatments for THEIR diplomats, too!
The Uncle Sam picture has always inspired that response in me. Look at him: A beady-eyed bully. Reminds me of the assholes I see on TV who beat their wives to a pulp and then stagger around outside their trailers talking tough. The icons of American power are as loathsome to me as those of Nazi Germany.
Remember what Franklin said about the Eagle?
You’re going to take up to help your Libyan brethren smash the U.S. state? Or are you hoping they will conveniently do it for you risking their lives so you don’t have to?
Typically idiotic post, Clover.
To answer your smear:
I feel sympathy for the Libyans. I understand their anger. I, too, loathe the government of the US – which committed war crimes against the Libyan people (bombing a sovereign country that had neither attacked nor threatened to attack the US) and loosed violence and chaos upon their country.
The Libyans are not my enemy. I feel for them – just as I feel for anyone assaulted by bullies.
Eric, what is going on Libya I believe is a manipulation.
Some dufus creates a very poorly done video where offensive lines are badly dubbed over whatever the actors said. This is then somehow used to inflame people overseas. It smells like a set up. They must have seen a different video or were lied to about it or incited by something else entirely. The odds of it even being just found online are small. Somebody or some group had to actively put in work to get people angry all over.
Now that they got angry and did something that in turn can be used to get other people, americans angry or otherwise emotionally accepting of some US military action or something else.
The question is, what are the manipulators up to?
I agree – as far as what they’re up to:
I suss this out as the opening sequence of a bigger opera, with an attack on Iran being the main event. They may see igniting a major regional war – and possibly more – as their next move. It would serve a variety of purposes:
* Provide the pretext for outright martial law.
* Silence the growing liberty/peace movement in the manner explained by Herr Goring.
* Shut people up about the disastrous state of the economy (“we’re at war”!)
* Lay the groundwork for the next phase of the NWO.
Among other advantages…
Yeah, I smell a psy-op too. The video was pathetic. What we’re seeing is the equivalent of Muslim rednecks riled up by the same type of agitprop they use over here to rile up our well-meaning rednecks against the Towelhead Menace(tm).
Sad that it works so well, even when it’s so transparent.
I realize it comes naturally, but try not to be stupid.
They’re not my brethren. But they’re rightfully pissed at what the American government at the behest of its controllers have done to Libya.
It’s no surprise there’s rage at the occupation; we may not have a presence there like we do in Iraq, but it’s quite clear who funded the operation.
Its nice to see jar jar bin binksistan hit the NWO stormtroopers with a fuselage of rocks and boobahs smack on the faceshields. Go rebel scum something something dark side.
I hope yoda gets a cage match with jabba the hut and merkel hilary and moochelle all get nipple chained and then sold at the next mecca infidel princess auction to be held in saddams old dungeon.
However nuking the planet or releasing bio weapons or otherwise intentionally wrecking the planet is orders more simple than controlling.
It’s like the smallest scale sociopath who can’t control the woman he married so he kills her.
If they feel they can “manage” it they’ll do it. Just enough slaves to do the labor and food production. Much like the Ashen in Stargate.
“Anyone who needs to be persuaded to be free, doesn’t deserve to be.” — L. Neil Smith
Hayek wrote: “It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society.”
Wolfgang Goethe: “None are so hopelessly enslaved, than those who believe they are free.”
“Liberty is meaningless if it is only the liberty to agree with those in power.” — Ludwig von Mises
“The reaction of a person to the idea of a truly free society is an excellent moral litmus test. The more negative the reaction, the more likely you’re dealing with a sociopath.” — Doug Casey, “On Anarchy,” October 1, 2010
“The world is no better than the people who see government as the answer to our problems.” — Anonymous
And – also for permission to use your earlier post as a feature article. Much appreciated!
Woi, soit’nly! ;-D
Or as I like to say,… Just how free are you if you’re not free to say, “No” without punishment?
Or that line from Star Trek. To quote Spock, “In an insane world the sane man must appear insane”.
“Sanity is not statistical”
– Winston Smith
Now just how long will it take to deprogram a Stockholm syndrome victim???
Oh che it! i make a mistake. It is not a Stockholm Syndrome Victim, it was a Goonberment Syndrome Victim! me bad me bad me bad. i soywee. i was edukaded in a skooz.
“Clover knows it – and will literally kill to prevent it.”
Clovers are mostly a gutless, tattle-tale lot preferring to have someone do their dirty work for them. Having government do one’s dirty work is equivalent to hiring a hit man.
The only good Clover is a dead one.
Clover = Quisling ?
Our society does not yet appreciate the implication of school; 12+ years of forcing individuals into subservience.
If you can put a mind into a wheelchair, you have no need to worry about the body.
Yessiree, Michael. It is 12+ years of child prison. Years ago my wife and I were investigating “Outcome Based Education” in Virginia and found out, right quick like, that the “Outcome” the PTB wants has nothing to do with actual “Education.” We learned that the techniques the schools were using ran the gamut from guided imagery (mass hypnosis), group therapy, psychological / sociological profiling (standardized tests) with the associated databases (SCANS / ERIC) on to confidential curriculum (handouts and tests mom and dad aren’t allowed to see) and even psychotropic drugs (e.g. Ritalin). This molds a crop of good little submissive, obeisant worker bees and soldier ants. But bullies seem to get a free pass just like in “the joint.” It’s disgusting; the perpetrators should be tarred, feathered and shunned.
We have no grandchildren ourselves, but a friend brings her 9 year old granddaughter to visit my wife and me from time to time. She is highly intelligent, artistic, imaginative, animated, funny and energetic; she (understandably) hates school and is having a hard time coping with all the bovine excrement. We try to teach her all we can from basic math (which, as BrentP observed, they don’t seem to be teaching in school nowadays) to how to use basic hand tools, simple manners, graphic art and proper grammar. She can actually write in cursive because her aunt taught her how; they don’t teach that at her school. She soaks up real, practical education like a sponge and asks for more.
I wish she was our blood kin because we’d be more than happy to home school her (and she wants us to). But instead she’s stuck in child prison where she gets bored, cuts up in class and is punished for normal and natural responses to a totally abnormal and regimented environment. Get this; they make her put her head down on her desk, put her fist on the back of her head and stick her thumb up in the air like a chicken crest and stay that way ‘til they say. What the hell is that? Maybe what they’re doing to break and indoctrinate this bright and promising child (and her peers) is one of the “benefits” Elisabeth believes we receive for the tax money the gun-vernment extorts from us…more on that subject in a later post.
This has all been foretold (by the german-philosophizing clown in the below video), it’s just difficult for people to hear, understand, and tell somebody else. I’ve always felt that if I knew better, and said nothing, I was an accomplice to ignorance. Sadly, most people don’t feel that way, and are more than happy to stand aside as our peers are handicapped and destroyed.
Also, there is a documentary about scenarios such as you describe you are experiencing http://www.thewaronkids.com
Another brick in the wall.
Michael et al,
You guys might want to read this rant I wrote a number of years back. I have some things to say about the public education process that are relevant though not as succinct or pithy as what you said above.
Eric, that picture isn’t you, between auto reviews, living out some secret S&M fantasy?
oh hail no!
Wink, wink, nudge, nudge. Say no more!
Say no more:
SEE! “A wink is as good as a nudge to a blind bat!” Know what I mean! Say no more! Nudge, nudge.
LOL! We’re dating ourselves here but at least I know some people appreciate the humor.
America: Land of the Free… and we’ll kill you to prove it! That’s about where the typical “thinking” resides.
“If you see something, say something.”… Oy vey! Now if that isn’t a throwback to the propaganda of WW2 I don’t know what is.
This all reminds me about a tale I read on Will Griggs’ blog years ago. One individual detailed his encounter with the friendly fuzz whereupon the jackbooted goon asked some personal questions that he had no business asking and was promptly told by this individual “No”. Whereupon this badged bully retorted with the usually well oiled lie “If you haven’t anything to hide then you have nothing to worry about”. The response to that was, “Well then, would you mind dropping your pants so I can see if in fact you didn’t molest young boys earlier today. Clearly if you did nothing wrong then there shouldn’t be any feces on your member” This made him, the cop, so angry that he told the questioner to get the hell on his way! Clearly absurd but it makes the rational point that if all you’re going by is the “accusation” then any question, both ways that is, is valid and shouldn’t be met by any resistance. The overlords and their foot soldiers don’t see it that way but that’s all the reason more why I’m telling them “NO” from now on.
“Well then, would you mind dropping your pants so I can see if in fact you didn’t molest young boys earlier today. Clearly if you did nothing wrong then there shouldn’t be any feces on your member”
Thanks for the Keeper.
Tinsley, I’m only going by memory and I’m actually being polite because the guy was much more direct and to the point. Still I laughed out loud when I first read it.
Based on his response, the cop in the story probably had something to hide.
“She parked in front of the post office, and as she was exiting the vehicle, an angry little man lectured her about the absence of the “safety” sticker on the truck. ”
Nope – true story; it helped inspire this column!
Ha ha, I’ll bet you right this minute that Clover has a tail-light out but won’t know it until a cop pulls him over and gives him a “correction” ticket (if they have those in your state). That’ll fluster him, and I only wish your wife could see it happen!
Dude, down here that’s grounds for an ass-whipping.
I don’t doubt it happened. I’ve had people pull their car a few inches from me as I am bicycling to preach the gospel of the foam hat. And the foam hat isn’t even a law here.
I understand the emotions though. I have them every time I get selectively enforced upon. I think a big part of the issue is that the clovers aren’t enforced upon enough. Most clovers don’t obey the laws they favor. They “trust the cop”. I see this every so often in news stories where some soccer mom or other sympathetic clover gets a ticket for something that I agree shouldn’t be ticketed for (most of the time) and how horrible the cops were by doing it, etc and so forth. But it’s always about how the person is a good up standing whatever and that’s why he/she doesn’t deserve a ticket. However those non sympathetic characters… such as that guy… over there… about 25 years old who drives a mustang, well he deserves it. Not Sally Soccer Mom with her minivan. Same exact act though.
Cloverism is very heavy on social perception, rank, etc and so on. After all, that’s why the president can order someone’s death. Because he’s the president, top of the social order. It’s also why that black kid driving the hoopty needs to be pulled over for doing 3mph over the speed limit that is set 20mph below the typical travel speed while some senior citizen cruises by unmolested by the authorities at 15 over the limit.
Perhaps it comes down to a fundamental difference in philosophy. A world run by logic, data, and reason or a world run by emotion, perception, and animal hierarchy.
I think that’s why technical people often go to libertarian ideas. Logic, data and reason. How many of us here are in technical professions regarding technology and machines and have technical hobbies? Practically all of us. Other people are more interested in the social world and the powers that be want them to be. Perhaps this is part of the reason government schools don’t teach math, science, etc very well.
RE “I think that’s why technical people often go to libertarian ideas. Logic, data and reason. How many of us here are in technical professions regarding technology and machines and have technical hobbies?”
You are an engineer I believe.
I am an Estimator.
What other “technical” professions are representated here…
I estimate 40% of my colleagues are libertarian also.
Thinking through systems analytically every day, following their logic to its conclusion…or destruction…makes the political system totally transparent.
Engineer, eh? And yet I’ve met my fair share who believe they can “fix” the corruption by working within the system. Sort of like saying you could turn what has already corroded into rust back into a piece of solid steel.
Ooops, cut off too soon. As I was saying… back into a piece of solid steel while the structure is still standing/falling. Just isn’t going to happen.
Instrumentation & controls tech here. Much of my job involves troubleshooting (root cause analysis), programming (PLC, DCS, HMI) and calibration. I’m in complete agreement with methylamine on having to follow a problem out to its logical and undeniable conclusion. The trouble with seeing through corporate, government and educational bureaucracies transparently is that it can make you cynical in short order.
Since I troubleshoot for a living, it’s hard for me to understand why many (if not most) Americans fail to see that the side of politics they are being shown publicly is nothing more than a movie set. Those of us that practice critical thinking in our jobs daily, try to open the doors on the set or walk around back and have a look. Hence we discover the buildings are props, nothing more than a façade, and the “leaders” are merely actors trying to extract as much wealth from us and control over us as they can before the show is over.
Movie set you say? Sounds like you’ve read some of what Frank Zappa said long ago.
I’m an artist. Being unplugged from the 9-5, combined with analyzing the philosophical slack of modern art has led me down the rabbit hole.
michael I’ve heard the Elite favor a particular form of highly degraded/degrading art; examples such as “Piss Christ” come to mind.
Can you comment?
BTW I agree that modern art is philosophically “slack”. It’s a symptom of decadence.
meth- I don’t know if I can really comment on that, I didn’t work my way toward having dealings with the elite. However, I would say that “modern art” as a whole is just a reflection of philosophical relativism. It’s the same thing as moral relativism, only through visual art. And success in visual art is largely attained in either
1) chipping away for decades
2) having tons of money (or moneyed promoters)
3) having big time connections
And not having any of these (time, money, connections) after almost a decade’s worth of effort, I just realized I had to branch out. You might see a lot of people at “Art Walks” selling various things, but you’ll see them when the art walk is over too..waiting tables.
Modern Art was beautifully summed up in The Fountainhead. When they’re talking about room for particular plays in the theatre. It’s exactly like that. And modern art was a rebellion against actual art, and has taken it over by flooding the market (twisting the language, and emotionally manipulating people). Tons of city budgets spend all kinds of massive amounts of money on horrible modern art displays, but when a real show comes to town (like Impressionists, or Sargent or even Norman Rockwell), once sparsely populated museums are filled to capacity; as the human spirit has a connection with real art that no manipulation can overcome.
But the manipulation can distort reality, control markets, and retain control at the top. And modern art serves this purpose in spades.
It’s funny, people complain about modern art and government exactly the same way, “Most of the time it just doesn’t make any sense”. Duh…because it’s not meant to.
Sorry…I flew off the handle. This is not something I get to talk about much. 🙂
There’s a definition of art – vs. not-art – I came across once that I’ve always liked:
If anyone could do it, it’s not art.
Anyone (just about) can learn the basics of welding. And mash together a few pieces of scrap iron. Not-art.
Michaelangelo; DaVinci. Art.
That’s right, I forgot about the dissection of art in The Fountainhead, thanks for the memory!
I totally agree vis-a-vis modern art not “making sense”; I see a Renoir or a Monet (my favorites) and feel a wonderful sense of yearning, or nostalgia, or peace. I feel *something*, and it’s powerful and moving. The realists–perhaps not as evocative, but I marvel at the photographic reality and what skill it took to paint.
Looking at Bauhaus design thrills me; that wonderful simplicity and purposeful-ness.
And then we hit the Da-da era and it just goes to crap! But it gets worse, because Dada is just noise; whereas Piss Christ and other shock-pieces are actively destructive.
Speaking of which–have you seen the Denver Airport atrocities?
I’m a complete novice with art so please forgive any misinterpretations above…
haha, that’s not a bad one, eric. I always say to people, the problem isn’t your definition or my definition, the problem is that we’re debating the definition. If artists do not know what art is, how can they make it? (which always leads to “uhhhh…..” and another subject)
meth- those murals are hilarious. i like the caption below one “order openly mocks us at denver airport”.
What blows my mind is how many great painters are painting today that NOBODY has heard about. We’ve got the greatest crop of representational painters the world has ever seen, and nobody knows. Richard Schmid, Clyde Aspevig, Scott Christensen, Zhaoming Wu, Yim Mau Kun, Paul Mullally, Tibor Nagy… there’s a hundred peeps who could rival the painters of a few generations ago–Sargent, Zorn, Sorolla..
I agree there is a degrading of art, but that’s in the area of what is promoted, socially pushed, what’s political, etc and so forth.
Modern art I think, as a term was created to include stuff like abstract art, art deco, industrial design, and so forth. A recognition of the artistic side of engineering too. There was an exhibit of motorcycles at a famous art museum. It was packed every day. People spend their money on industrial art with many products they buy. So the motorcycles attracted huge crowds. It was free market art.
The crap that’s pushed out on us for shock value and social status and whatever… it’s political art. That’s why it needs the state to take money from productive people to keep it going. That’s the money for the ‘arts’. It’s what we are supposed to think is good because authorities tell us it is.
But put a display on art people freely put their money towards… well then it’s packed.
Being a romantic I enjoy Sargent or anything similar. I prefer something to soothe the soul versus reinforcing some nihilistic philosophy.
Sargent, at his best, is the best the world has ever seen.
He could capture MOMENTS and MOODS in OIL PAINT!!!! http://www.flickr.com/photos/renzodionigi/2736439955/
See? Now there’s something I couldn’t do (not one in a million of us could do). Art.
Unlike, say, Piss Christ. Or a series of Campbell soup cans. Or a couple of rusty I beams welded at weird angles….
Thanks for the link. I recognized Paul Revere from my history book.
I always liked El Greco painting of Christ bearing the cross at the MET in NYC. The eyes are so lifelike. The painting always moves me when I see it.
At times I would like the artistic ability to paint well. I have to be satisfied with the ablity to enjoy good artwork.
I’m a mechanical engineer at one of the “big” three. Until I put in my notice Monday.
I can tell you from my experience that there are plenty of technical clovers in the automotive industry. I see impending doom via CAFE, and all the “not ready for prime time” (expensive an unreliable ) fuel economy tricks up our sleeve.
Don’t get me wrong, I think stop/start is a pretty good idea – for the very small minority of drivers who arrange work schedules that force them sit in traffic not moving for hours a day. Me – I arrange my schedule to not be on the road at peak hours. I will be subsidizing this since it wont make a measurable difference in my mpg since I rarely stop. So will all you other drivers who don’t drive at peak time or come to many long, complete stops.
Also, if your A/C is needed for windshield defrost, and you’re using rear defrost, a blower motor, and seat heaters, your battery is being drained very quickly from these high current devices. Throw some headlights, brake lights, and amplifiers on here for good measure.
All who may not be familiar, any safety system must have severity 10 on it DFMEA and PFMEA for components that may fail and affect the “safety” of the car. It costs a lot of money to design in redundant backups for systems that weren’t considered “safety items” yesterday but will be considered such tomorrow. This sometimes requires retooling complicated items that had years of design life left in them – to the scrap heap. What a freaking waste. All to make happy the clovers who choose to sit in traffic for hours a day on socialist roads. Market based roads would charge a premium for driving during peak hours – ending much of the congestion.
By the way – those same clovers who proudly throw away tens of millions of dollars worth of design, testing, and tooling by forcing these “better” requirements on the industry at gunpoint – decades prematurely – will be glad to lecture me for not “recycling.”
Whenever I get the non-recycling lecture, I say “Not only do I not recycle, but I sneak outside and dump my neighbor’s recycling into my trash can.” When they inevitably say “YOU DON’T REALLY DO THAT?,” I say no – the city does much of that for me – since many of the items you took unpaid time and labor to separate end up in the same dump as my trash.
I try to explain why these CAFE and safety measures will put us all out of a job and I’m the freak who’s crazy.
Of course there are. Good at school engineers are by and large of the clover mind. These are people who are good at school and institutions. They really aren’t engineers. They can’t design their way out of a wet paper bag.
Politically skewed DFMEA is nuts. I didn’t even have to deal with that when I worked in the medical device industry. It wasn’t a low risk device, someone could bleed to death or get toxins directly into their blood if it went wrong and those failure modes got the appropriate rankings, but there were safety things that weren’t quite so severe.
Hope you have something else lined up work wise.
Living in the country, I’ve come to know people with almost no formal education who can out-engineer formally taught engineers I know. I don’t mean just fixing things – though that’s certainly an aspect of it. I also mean the ability to conceptualize a solution to a problem and implement it. To re-engineer something – and the end result is better than the original.
One VA Tech engineering grad I know literally cannot frame a basic 2×4 wall on his own, or do a valve adjustment on a motorcycle. I doubt very much he’d be able to build the solar water heater system my neighbor (who has a high school education only) put together out of mostly scrap parts last year.
Brent, you’re so right. It always makes me chuckle when people talk about their “qualifications” or “credentials”, and all they do is list “undergraduate here…graduate there”. Credentials these days have nothing to do with working accomplishments, but everything to do with being a good hoopjumper at some school.
Getting good grades in school means…….you’re good at getting good grades at school. (Jokes on you!) lol
Here’s a true story in re your observation:
I know someone who has been in school literally since childhood and never worked at a real job. This person went from high school to college to graduate school to a PhD program in “business administration.” Now, this person is a professor of business administration receiving a six figure income at a public (government) college! Teaching how to “administer” businesses! Businesses this person has zero experience with – even as a mailroom clerk!
I was thinking along these very lines a couple weeks back when I was test driving the new BMW 3 – which has the auto-stop function. I was thinking: How much more does the starter motor for this system cost vs. a conventional starter motor – one that’s not subjected to constant use and which isn’t expected to provide near-instantaneous and imperceptible re-starts? I would not be surprised to find out that a replacement starter for the new BMW 3 costs in the neighborhood of $1,500. Not counting labor. And how long will this starter last? I am skeptical these start-stop starters are “lifetime” (or even 10 year) units. I bet they crap out a lot sooner.
Now, a BMW owner maybe can deal with having to replace a $1,500 starter every five or six years or so.
But how about the owner of a $15,000 car?
As you mention, things like start-stop are going to become commonplace on all types of cars soon, as a way to meet the pending CAFE edicts.
And that’s just for openers…
eric- of course. Getting a degree doesn’t mean you can work in the market, but getting a degree is the only requirement to teach.
Wrap your head around this one: I can draw like this http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-fggnzKeFA88/TcDIrzRRuCI/AAAAAAAAACA/wkZZnv32cl0/s1600/CIMG0593.jpg
But due to a lack of bachelors degree, I cannot teach (it is forbidden for administrative reason) at any level of accredited school (high school, college).
Why would business be any different?
Thanks all, it gets even worse and I am sure Blake has seen it too… In engineering departments there are your engineers with knack and your good-at-school engineers. Good-at-school people can work in any profession in this society because they can get the degrees and licenses. They can’t do the work because they don’t have a knack for it.
So what happens is the good at schools become the managers because if the engineers with talent were promoted who would do the work? Also while the work is being done the good at schools can play the politics and do the social things to get promoted while the talented just work.
Which then leads to all the braindead polices, ideas, procedures and so forth. Things that are social, that feel good, but are just plain idiocy.
On the starter motor for automatic start stop. A properly specified brushless motor should last forever if the required torque can be obtained from a brushless design and the controller’s components are quality pieces. With a brush motor the only thing that should wear out is the brushes. Make the pinion and the ring gear fit for the duty they will see and it should out last the car.
Now the problem is they are going to cheap out somewhere. That’s where the problem will be. It may not even be the motor itself, perhaps the switching they use to activate it. A high current relay to activate it. FETs in a control for a brushless design. They may go brushless because they can avoid the high current relay. The engine computer talks to the starter motor controller. The starter motor controller always has high current available but doesn’t tell the motor to go until needed…
Great observation on school-smart “engineers” vs. actually competent engineers!
My brother-in-law and I are both pretty decent mechanics. Our fathers taught us from early on…I was taking apart lawnmower engines when I was nine, and we both rebuilt our own engines in high school.
When we were at university together, he was earning significant beer-money doing simple fixes for our fellow engineering students! A straight-A mechanical engineering student couldn’t replace an alternator…and that was just one small example.
Software is the same way. Fewer than half the guys I work with are formally trained in computer science, and roughly ten percent never went to college.
It makes exactly ZERO difference. A motivated software engineer can pick up as much formal computer science as he has the desire and inclination to do…and in a much more profitable way than $100,000 of student loans.
I’ve got a degree in Electrical Engineering but work mostly with software currently.
One of the most frustrating things about working in technology is the government. I currently work for a company which probably sells 50%+ of goods produced to the government. I have looked for other career options but the government intervention is pervasive. Are there any technology fields that are still primarily controlled by free market forces?
Not that I can think of.Even independent shops are subject to numerous government regulations and controls. It’s what’s kept me from opening a shop devoted to repairing and restoring old bikes. The compliance hassles are just too much for me to even think about.
Grant that’s one big reason I switched from medicine to software–it’s almost completely a meritocracy, and I *never* deal with government. Ever.
Go look around at some recruiters for independent software consultants. If you have a decent amount of experience and you work in standard technologies–.NET, Java, C++, Python, Ruby etc.–you can expect at least $70/hr, and with a decade or two of experience, twice that.
I simply refuse any gov-connected job, or any job for mostly gov-funded industries. I won’t work for Halliburton here in town, for instance. But there are thousands of businesses that need software; they’re *desperate* for good people.
I’m often on the hiring side, interviewing candidates. We’re constantly looking–and good people go fast.
That sounds like what I’m looking for. I’m sick of request from the higher-ups asking employees to write congress to end sequestration. It is maddening to be part of such a corrupt system!
I don’t know what you guys are complaining about..
Just be happy and give the government all you can! LOL
“U Didn’t Build That!”
Grant, go for it!
And go contract, corp-to-corp. Use LegalZoom to set up an LLC; it’ll take you an entire twenty minutes and cost about three hundred bucks.
Take your incorporation papers to a bank–use a small local one, the big ones just absolutely suck–and set up a business account.
Then go a-huntin’ for contract software jobs. There are thousands.
I can’t recommend contract highly enough. It takes you out of the “employee” mindset; you actually work harder, but it’s more satisfying. The whole “your own boss” thing is good and bad; my boss is a total dick. He’s always bitching about how much taking vacation costs, etc etc…but overall I get along with him 🙂 You may be kinder to yourself.
It pushes you to pick up new skills constantly.
If you land a sweet gig, great; not so great? Formulate an exit strategy, button up your part of the work, and get the next one.
Being contract will give you a huge head-start survival-wise over the unawakened employees.
You remind me of my last run-in with people pushing the Small Business Administration when all I ever saw were seminars and such geared for a “business” to sell to the government! If you had an idea totally unrelated to pimping your wares to the Feds then it appeared the SBA didn’t give a shit about you. Small business, my ass!
I guess in a way I can agree with your assertion that tech folks make up a large part of the libertarian leaning populace….except that I first caught the bug when I was getting my undergraduate degree in psychology. I could be an outlier though. I did go on to graduate school in computer science but that was years after I met Murray Rothbard and was involved in the LP before it totally sold out.
In terms of the theme of this blogpost, I pretty much concur with Eric. Interestingly, Eric seems to be one of the few internally consistent libertarian bloggers I read on a regular basis. The idea that clovers want to control the behavior of others is what underpins the the acceptance of power by the warmongers. I am reminded of the pride that Winston Smith’s neighbor took in his own children as they turned him in to Big Brother. Things will get a lot worse in the near term but Ron Paul has shined the light on man behind the curtain for a lot of activist young people. There is some justification for some small amount of hope. Of course, the Clovers of the world will be totally surprised and confused as they board the trains for the FEMA camps. Forgive the rambling invective….I’ve been at this a long time.
War is Peace
Freedom is Slavery
Ignorance is Strength
Clover words to live by
It’s just an observation, not an assertion and it certainly isn’t absolute. Just tendencies, a shift in the mean towards libertarian ideas.
All one has to do is clearly show the younger generation how they have been screwed. Keep talking about freer and more prosperous times and how they went away. Even the young who feel instead of reason will want real change then.
Additionally, to your point about tech folks and libertarianism, look at the kind of argument that libertarianism and the like are very good at making: an intellectual one. Advocates of Freedom, thus far, are not as good at making an emotional argument, which is the level that many people operate on. Movies are statist. Music is statist. Arts are statist. And on and on… with few exceptions.
But slowly peeps are coming on board with quality emotional pleas. I see a real opportunity there.
I’m leery of appealing to people’s emotions – for many reasons, but chiefly, because it’s conceding they can’t be reached on a truly human level. Then again, perhaps by appealing to their moral emotions – the sense of natural law that many people have – it may be possible to awaken their reason. For example, most people have an empathetic capacity and understand at a gut level – at an emotional level – that causing physical pain (and psychological pain, also) to others is “not cool.” If you can get them to appreciate that using force is bad – because force involves pain and suffering – then maybe you can get them to take that Great Leap Forward…
Still, it’s a difficult thing for me to countenance. I feel as though I am trying to train a labrador retriever….
I agree with you. However, when you look at our society, look at how many people NEVER develop the ability to critically think? And (it is my opinion), not because they have been taught, or given room, and they have failed, but because we live within a system that attempts to destroy that faculty within people before they have developed it. Notice how our society seems relatively peaceful and serene, but all methods of control focus on maintaining illusions and mind control.
I’m not saying that an intellectual or moral argument isn’t superior; it is. What I am saying is that people don’t understand ANY intellectual or moral argument. What I am suggesting is that the message be translated into something they understand, with the goal of cultivating independent thought and self reliant behavior, and I think it is happening naturally (slowly). Every apathetic fool in the grips of conventional tomfoolery is one more body that the inertia of Freedom must overcome.
That’s how the ruling elite have treated people. As domesticated animals. They do things to make people more and more like domesticated animals and treat them as such. It’s been working. Now their emotional reaction to realizing they have been treated like livestock might have a benefit.
You’ve nailed the underlying psychology
of Cloverism by focusing on the battle
between EMOTION and REASON, which is
fought within and outside each one of us,
and which battle I try and explain in the
last two posts on this page:
Also, keep in mind that all of these terms –
enfolded into the meaning of
LEFTISM – are CLOVERISM at work: Marxism / socialism / communism / Nazism / feminism / (non-classical) liberalism / communitarianism.
and without, and which battle this
Beware of anyone who argues from “I feel that…” rather than “I think that…”
U.S. films are censored by catholic league of decency and successors since 1934. If you search pre code warren william in youtube you will see dialog humor and real world plotlines never permitted since 1930-1934 heyday of talking pictures.
I began my adult life (after dropping out of college) working on a dairy farm – which means, if it’s not working, you figure out how to fix it yourself, or learn to do without, because you can’t afford to hire it done. Then a few years in a machine shop making oil field equipment. Move to another shop as a CNC programmer and operator making medical research equipment. Now doing customer service/tech support at same company.
You may be correct. I am an electronics engineer and both design circuitry and program micros and other programmable devices. My guess is about 50% of engineers, many more, are libertarians in thought. Maybe 10% are Cloveritos (little Clovers)and 10% hardcore Clovers. I also work with a group of commercial pilots, most all are Clover Lite and stand 95% behind the trailer trash who live in the White House at any given time. He is The President, not My President. The idea that the string of Oval/Oral Office nitwits are leaders is a bad joke. They get my respect only at gunpoint. Absent the gun, my respect evaporates.
If I were to point out that the so-called Dark Ages aren’t quite as dark as all that once one starts to study them, and that the most medieval of burnings-at-the-stake – and the most numerous – happened well after the Middle Ages, it would be merely to nit-pick. I wholly applaud your main point; I too am astonished at the illusion of liberty under which some appear to labour.
I am reminded of the elaborate shrug given by the unspecified western European, with desultory mumblings about “‘aving ze coffee …” when confronted with the idea that our real, practical liberty is being rapidly eroded. For some, freedom is nothing more than a concentration camp whose coffee-times are frequent and random. But I am reminded of something else, which I suspect might be concomitant.
We have in the so-called West the tendency to overestimate not only our liberty but also our practical power. One sees this in the way the concept of the Ecological Footprint – originally a perfectly useful construct – is nowadays applied. We tend to do it literally, as if we are actually, willingly, and personally doing all this nasty stuff; and as a result we are quite easily made to feel guilty about it. As another and equally unfortunate result, we are blinded to the systemics of things: we just have no way of understanding the origin or the import of What I Need To Do Tomorrow Morning, and hence no way of beginning to pick apart the muddles of dependency that account for the best part of what people do every day.
Ecological Footprint? Would this be in parallel with the calls for taxing our Carbon Footprint and other rot-gut excuses for further totalitarianism?
When it comes to people arguing that what mankind does is “unnatural” I first off have to ask them if they believe man “evolved” just as all other species (I don’t but that’s another story). If they agree with that then the argument is pretty short.
You see if man is simply just another species on the evolutionary highway then everything he does is “natural” and thus what you see around you, ugly as it may be, is natural as well. It’s baked into the cake so to speak. So to rail and rant and seek to punish mankind based on his innate behavior is unnatural. That doesn’t mean you shouldn’t take care of what is around you but that is up to you to freely decide.
I won’t go into any theological arguments because I personally, as an agnostic, don’t subscribe to nor deny any.
Ever see those history of the earth theory programs… where they state that bacteria changed the atmosphere so that plants and then animals other more complex forms of life could come about?
What if man’s purpose is to produce CO2 from hydrocarbons from the bowels of the earth and release it into the air such that plants can grow? Such that live can thrive further? I’ve long thought this could be a part of what man is supposed to do. Life needs carbon. It needs CO2.
That’s reasonable BrentP, but I subscribe to George Carlin’s magnificent Theory of Human Life’s Purpose: Plastic.
We’re here to produce plastic. The Earth didn’t have it before, and it didn’t have a way to make it; so it made humans.
And when we’re gone, our plastic detritus will remain after us.
BTW CO2 levels are at all-time historic lows. So low, in fact, that it’s limiting plant growth.
Our puny (3%) contribution to world CO2 production might not be enough.
I’m doing my part to increase CO2 by driving a 5 liter V8 like I stole it–what are you guys doing to preserve plant life on this planet?
See? I *AM* an environmentalist after all.
Right on methyl! I’m riding the piss out of bike that should get over 50 MPG and managing to keep it in the high 30’s. But I am trying to minimize damage to the public roads by only running on the rear wheel or just the sides of the tread as much as possible. The “air pump” block off is sitting on my bench to be installed soon. Keep up the good work! 😉
That is so considerate, I thank you for preserving the roads in that manner!
Why, all for the Common Good of course.
All Hail the Collective!
I’m going to steal and mash up part of your quote. It’s a keeper….
“Drive it like you stole it”
Of course I loved Carlins skit on the environment.
“There’s nothing wrong with the planet. It’s the people who’re fucked up!”
Carlin was brilliant –
His only flaw, intellectually/morally speaking, was that he never (apparently) made it to the NAP. He saw tyranny – and cupidity and stupidity. But his solutions were of the well-meaning left-liberal sort. More “schools,” more “social safety net” – etc. – not grasping the violence he was endorsing in the name of humanity.
I’ve frequently mentioned that point as well – what if humans are introducing more carbon into the biosphere to increase Earth’s carrying capacity for life.
No steve, we’re here to produce plastic. It’s the one thing Earth can’t produce.
I miss George Carlin.
But yes–CO2 is at historically low levels; our contribution is a piddling 5 GT out of Earth’s 150 GT annually (60 from land, 90 from sea).
But I’m doing my part; I average 13mpg around town and 18.5 on the highway.
Aw geez! Bad me, repeat post, my apologies. Forgot to read the thread.
It’s OK Methyl, I missed it the first time.
My gas guzzling V8 is down while I try again to find an elusive vacuum leak hiding somewhere in my intake manifold. In the meantime I’m driving my not so gas guzzling V8 smoovee, which get’s 16 mpg. The 928 burns 92 octane at a rate of 8 mpg so it will be much better for the planet once I get it running.
Is that wrong?
Something’s gotta be not-right….
My Trans-Am, with a 7.4 liter V-8 (455) does considerably better than 8 MPG….
How can anything that feels as good as 8mpg, be bad?
Which 928 is that Scott? My lawyer friend just finished a minor rebuild of his. Fantastic cars, immortalized in “Risky Business”. They have such a wonderful exhaust note–kind of a cross between an American 45-degree crank and a Ferrari flat-crank.
A melodious warble at idle, and a nearly frenetic scream at high revs. Just MUSIC!
How the hell do you get 8mpg from what is it, a 4 liter? 4.5 at most?
I shall endeavor to do more for Mother Earth. It’ll be planting time in Spring–must make more plant food!
MoT, if what we see around us is a “natural” evolutionary response, then it follows that the railing and ranting is also natural and part of the process.
Bingo! That would follow, too.
What Clover and others that are addicted to the state fail to realize is the “outliers” are the fringes of the herd. As the regime labels and picks off the non-conformists, the “outliers”, those that consider themselves more “middle of the road” or “mainstream” come closer to being on the fringe and eventually they get picked off as well. By the time Clover reaches the fringe through attrition, it’ll be too late to do anything about it but he can’t think two moves ahead. And right now he’s comfortable and he’ll probably sell out his own family members to keep that level of comfort if need be. After all, he’ll be able to justify it because they were “breaking the law” and deserved what they got.
Right now, today, just about anyone, anywhere at any time is doing just that, because our legal system is so complex and all encompassing that it makes Babylonian law look like a first grade reading book. We “outliers” are canaries in the coal mine for Clover and he’s apparently too dense to realize that. If the PTB can silence us, commit us to mental institutions, harass us for engaging in perfectly lawful activities they don’t agree with, deny us fundamental rights “for our own safety”, steal our property, investigate and incarcerate us for “pre-crimes” and even shoot us down with impunity; then they can do the same thing to Clover. But he’ll deny it, because it hasn’t happened to him yet. And if by chance it does, I’d bet he’ll even make excuses for his persecutors to avoid the cognitive dissonance one suffers when confronted with the hard cold truth.
As I’ve said, by the time the dairy farm becomes a meat factory, it’s too late for the cows to do anything about it.
Oh that’s an excellent saying, michael, may I borrow it?
Go for it.
The plight of the cow is a running theme in the book, I think you’ll enjoy it; from the pasture, to the dairy farm, to the meat factory. Just in case slavery seems like too abstract of a concept, though slavery it is.
More info about book, please.
You can read and see more at my site http://endlessunlimited.com/?page_id=217
I long ago started calling the USA the “Federal Farm” so your quote dovetails into my own thinking.
Sounds kind of like Starr Parker’s book “Uncle Sam’s Plantation,” about how the welfare system keeps folks (especially blacks) enslaved by engendering dependence.
YES! And that is the purpose of the welfare state–to engender a dependent lower class to be used as the anvil against which to smash the middle class when the Elite’s hammer comes down.
The middle class will clamor for a police state when the FSA* hordes come knocking in their neighborhoods, never realizing the same State created the problem in the first place.
*Free Shit Army (not my invention, someone else on this board)
This is an absolutely 100 percent accurate, chilling account of today’s state of affairs. It wouldn’t have done for that old clover to bother me about an inspection sticker. I would have made him sniff the car exhaust. I despise people like that. I fear where we are headed. I wish I had the means to leave.
I’m still wavering on the idea of leaving, swamprat.
Elsewhere and other times on this site I’ve announced I’m sure we’re leaving…but to where?
Sure–even Mexico is more free than here in most respects. But for how long? Chile–same thing; but go there, and in five, ten, twenty years the New World Order will be there, too.
They’re targeting America most viciously because of our very heritage, and because of what we represent to the rest of the world. Europe? They were cowed and enslaved generations ago. They were never really free, as we were at one time.
So it will be hell here…at first. Then elsewhere, if America falls.
I have no interest in martyrdom; but neither do I wish to live as a slave. Can I avoid it short-term by expatriating? Probably. But it will come. And it will definitely come if America is subjugated fully.
So what to do? Here’s my general plan:
1) continue to speak out. Silence now is acquiescence; they’re starting to black-bag dissidents, especially veterans who’ve awakened. Now is the time to be most vocal, because anything less will ensure absolute tyranny.
2) have a bug-out place that’s safer than living in Houston; go to it if my family is in physical danger.
3) hope like hell the psychopathic elites don’t pull the trigger on their NBC arsenal.
Remember, they want at least 90% of us “useless eaters” DEAD, as in no longer breathing, as in shuffled off this mortal coil. As in not bothering them anymore.
So go out and bother them. Because they can still be defeated.
Not everyone is a busybody clover, YET.
Your comments are greatly appreciated. Unfortunately, I have come to the exact same conclusion. The least we could do as a weak generation of citizens, on the verge of relinquishing our freedoms and fortunes is to make every Effort to stop the machine.
It sucks to be totally surrounded by clovers, as most of them are beyond educating.But as i’ve heard quoted recently, “Those people don’t count. They never have. They never will.” However, in the interest of being the best American(old definition) that I can, I have to constantly remind myself that part of my unspoken contract, as I imagine the founding fathers would consider inherent of a real patriot, is to maintain complete and clear moral responsibility as to the maintenance this of this country and everyone in it…
Granted, everyone these days seem too have a little Clover in them. So, I would expect my optimism to be criticized for many reasons. After all, what makes me so special? Am I really capable of restoring something as, llarge as a nation? Should I battle a monster so large with so many weapons? What Makes me think that I have any right? This is a partial list of questions asked by clovers.
In general I agree with your statements and conclusions. However, as you stated, silence is acquiescence. The government gets to steal your labor (if we can agree that your money is a liquid form of your labor) through garnishment (withholding) to further their agenda. By choosing to be a U.S. citizen and pay taxes are you not complicit to the crimes of the state?
The recent events of QE3 and the reaction to the turmoil in the Middle East have nearly made me abandon any hope that the ship can be righted. But as you said, where is there to go?
Grant–YES, that one torments me horribly. The more successful I am, the more I contribute to my own enslavement and the barbaric treatment of others.
OTOH I have family here. I have history here. I’m an immigrant myself, from South Africa, and we believed in the ideals this place stood for.
And I want to fight for those ideals, because they are right.
Are we complicit when our money is stolen to pay for government atrocity?
Perhaps not. It’s like blaming the victim of a mugging for the murder the mugger committed later with a gun purchased with the money he stole from the first victim. My taxes are stolen from me involuntarily; I pay them under the worst duress, because to not pay them and resist being forced to pay them means death–identical to a mugging at gunpoint.
The ship can’t be righted in its current form. It’s up to us to build the lifeboats, shepherd as many as we can off the decks and into them, and ferry them to the next ship.
I’m more and more convinced we are looking at a sea-change in human thought as significant as the Reformation; one that will overturn the illusion of state power just as the Catholic church was destroyed.
Starve the beast!!!! goto http://www.losthorizions.com to find out the liberating truth about the income tax as it applies to most of us private citizens.
The question isn’t whether the individual income tax is at odds with individual liberty (it is) or contrary to the plain intent of the Constitution (ditto) or even whether it is technically legal (properly ratified; having lawful authority, etc.). The question is simply: What will happen if you stop paying the tax they claim you “owe”?
And the answer is: They will send men with guns to drag you from your home (ultimately). You will lose whatever property you nominally possess. They may throw you in a cage. If you defend yourself, they will kill you.
And the courts will “amen” the entire proceeding.
So, while I am in sympathy with the views expressed by the author of the material in the link you posted, it should be read with the understanding that anyone who acts on the recommendations given is certain to regret it.
On your statement:
“By choosing to be a U.S. citizen and pay taxes are you not complicit to the crimes of the state?”
This strikes me as more than a little harsh, even if technically true. What’s the alternative? Go to prison; lose everything you have ( (refuse to pay taxes). Or, live (somehow) by not earning taxable income and possess nothing that can be taxed. Or, leave the country and go…. where?
I agree with Meth. We have no real choice as regards taxes; we are compelled to pay under duress. It’s unfair, as I see it, to characterize this as being complicit when the alternative is literally death – or what amounts to it.
I certainly didn’t mean to be harsh nor was my comment intended as a criticism toward anyone. After all, I’m in this boat too. It was more a vocalization of my recent thoughts.
The fact is that expatriation is currently a peaceable alternative to supporting the Leviathan, albeit with significant sacrifice.
No problemo, Grant!
On expatriation: It’s not as easy as it sounds. You’ll need, for openers, to figure out how to get legal residency in a foreign country. This is often a tough nut to crack. Then, you’ll need to figure out how to make a living – for many of us, this would mean starting from scratch in middle life (or later).
And none of this – expatriation – means leaving oppression behind. Where can you go to escape Cloverism? I know of no place on this earth – excepting the most remote/isolated.depopulated places.
Besides, fuck ’em. I am not ready to just walk away from everything I have spent a lifetime building. This is my home, my land. I am prepared to fight for them – and for myself – if it comes to that.
I understand and largely concur with your argument but in the interest of debate allow me to extend mine further, if I may. What would you do if the government were to reinstate conscription? Then, the government would have the power to directly steal your labor rather than merely indirectly through taxation. Are you complicit then and if so where is the line?
Also, while I appreciate the mugger analogy, I find it flawed. If the crime were to be committed once then the victim could be excused, but if the victim were to repeatedly put themselves in the same situation knowing the result, I’m not sure they remain innocent. If the victim has a means to avoid the situation, then it becomes his responsibility to protect himself.
Again, this is not directed toward anyone; all my comments are in the spirit of debate and intellectual discovery. I am increasingly frustrated that the government, supposedly representing me, goes abroad murdering and pillaging. I don’t want to have any part of it. I would very much like to believe that logic can reveal a peaceful alternative to armed revolt.
You’re absolutely right; to paraphrase Stefan Molynux (sp?) – we are free range cattle who are being packed off to the feed lot – and from there to you know where.
I suppose each of us must decide when enough’s enough – or rather, when we’ve no longer got anything left to lose. I suspect that time is not far away for most of us, either.
@Grant–interesting questions, and taken in the spirit you intend…as intellectual debate, not attack.
re: repeated mugging–yeah I can see that. So in essence I’m balancing the following:
1) I’ve built a lot here physically and emotionally; house, career, family, friends.
2) Escaping loses those but means I stop paying into a totally immoral system; I’ve researched what we’ve done overseas, and it is horrible beyond description. Children’s legs burned off with white phosphorus, their land salted with depleted uranium, a horror show of resulting birth defects. *I* helped pay for that.
3) Escaping means temporary safety for my family from the coming police state; but the NWO control freaks, if they get America, will go everywhere. Any place with any level of prosperity will be wired into the control grid; and IT tech is so cheap now that total surveillance–especially financial*–will be ubiquitous.
What’s the answer? I suspect it’s going to be passive-aggressive. More and more people are becoming independent contractors; be slow with your taxes. A few will start escaping the noose; too many (like in Italy) will be “cheating” on their taxes to enforce so they’ll fry a few fish but miss the majority. Under-the-table transactions in cash or precious metals will grow. As time goes on, you’ll see more and more people “out of the system” entirely.
I advocate agorism. Don’t fight it directly; it’s a total waste of time, except for some small local issues (like us getting TSA kicked off Houston Metro). Instead, “the best revenge is living well”–and the mechanisms above will let us do that.
I want to be Rhett Butler from “Gone with the Wind”; he provided needed items to willing customers at a profit, and FUCK the state.
*financial control–the ultimate goal being a surprisingly biblical “mark on the forehead or right hand”. As Nick Rockefeller (may his soul rest in torment) said, “chip’em, and if they get out of line turn it off.” Meanwhile he and his cronies would have “KMA” cards–“Kiss My Ass”, total insulation. If your chip stops working, guess what? No grocery shopping. No job. No apartment.
“Under-the-table transactions in cash or precious metals will grow.”
I can see this becoming more prevalent in the near future:
Bitcoin P2P Digital Currency – http://bitcoin.org/
One has to choose his battles, I guess. Currently, I’m not in any position to take on that gang of fascist thugs calling itself the IRS.
Indeed; I structure my activities so that I pay as little as possible and get as much as possible (if Leviathan is being generous, why refuse?). In fact, Uncle Sam will be paying for my trip to South America early next year.
My dad’s uncle was a former IRS agent that turned against them, and then got locked up for five years on trumped-up charges after agents broke into his house and stole all the files he was compiling for a lawsuit.
You either play the game and bend the rules whenever possible, or go to prison (or get shot). I try to just keep my head down.
“(if Leviathan is being generous, why refuse?)”
I have no problem with this. Anything to hasten the collapse…
> I have no interest in martyrdom; but neither do I wish to live as a slave.
This is how our founding fathers worded it in their paper, “Declaration on the Causes and Necessity of Taking Up Arms”, July 6, 1775:
“… we will, in defiance of every hazard, with unabating firmness and perseverence, employ for the preservation of our liberties; being with one mind resolved to die freemen rather than to live slaves.”
By-the-way, this is a most interesting document; written a year before the Declaration of Independence, Congress was informing the Brits that we were not seceding, but we were willing to use arms to defend ourselves. Every one of the complaints listed in this document are now being perpetrated against us, the American citizen.
You can read this document at http://avalon.law.yale.edu/18th_century/arms.asp
Sud Afrika you say? I dig that accent from the ladies. Charlize Theron! My kids think I’m weird.
I like a place where the leader has multiple wives. And Neil Blomkamp makes district 9 in Joberg come to life. You MNU fookers says wikus van der merwe. Leave us alone. Us objectivist prawns are better than you.
Let Us repair the Atlas Spaceship Prometheus Rand and ARISOTLE GAVE AND PEACEFULLY FLY AWAY TO WHERE WE BELONG.
Either that or number 5 will dissasemble all the good stuff including the internet and leave the planet of the different colored apes to chimp it out like sysiphus.
Suid Afrika–land of wonders. Truly, truly beautiful country; you literally gasp in wonder when you drive the narrow highway north of Cape Town and as you round each curve, new vistas with beaches and sea on your right and vineyards on your left open up.
Then when you visit the highveld and the air turns crisp and so clear that the acoustics are different–high frequencies travel better in the thin (5000 feet in JoBurg) and dry air. Go a little further north-east, and you’re in the best game reserves in the world.
It’s an amazing place. Pity about the inhabitants.
I lost my accent because it’s not fun having every bully in grade school get on you because you’re different. Made me learn to fight, though.
I have to chime in here. I dated a woman who was from CapeTown. When I visited there, it was the best vacation of my life! Such beauty. I remember all the wonderful sights and sounds. We went up to wine country. We got to see an aviary as well. It reminded me of California with all of the diversity so close by.
I always told myself: “If I get really rich, I’m buying a winter home in Capetown.” Nuts on going to Florida for the winter. Capetown is where it’s at. Isn’t it listed as one of the best cities in the world?
I agree about the inhabitants though. Pity. I don’t know if it is as safe now as when I visited in 1999.
Thanks for the good memories. Made my day!
South African Rugby. Some of the best on the planet. I used to subscribe to a service that broadcast the Currie Cup online. They went under, and no one bought the rights 🙁
I was from Germany originally and didn’t start speaking English until I was about six or so. Imagine being told “You’re not from around here” for the next thirty years. At least I can now imitate a Texan and fool ’em but good! Yessir! The irony is going elsewhere and they still tell me I’m an outsider but with a Texas twang! That’s messed up!
@lberns1… Rugby? Yeah, that’s always good to watch, especially for someone partial to the Kiwis, but for more action I’d lean towards Aussie Rules Football.
Love the AFL and NRL. Gearing up for both Grand Finals. Would love to see the Rabbitohs pull it off, but those Bulldogs are a tough team.
@lberns1 “Love the AFL and NRL.”
I confess that I’ve always been something of an odd ball. When I was in High School back in the late 70’s and asked my PE coach if we could play Soccer/Fusball I was laughed at. I prefer Rally Racing to anything the freakish NASCAR has to offer. Not impressed with American football because I don’t see much “foot” being employed so I lean elsewhere. Don’t drink “lite” sissified beers (an abomination I say) And can say, having drunk the REAL Budwiser from Europe while visiting Dresden that our domestic product is colored piss. To each their own but I can confidently say I’m not your typical bloke.
“Bring out the Gimp”