Quick – But Not So Fast

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You have probably heard a lot about the quickness of EVs – and what you have heard is true. Some of them, like the Tesla S “plaid” – the reference is to the ’80s Spaceballs movie; “plaid” is one notch above ludicrous speed – are very quick indeed.

But most of them aren’t very fast – which you’ve probably not heard as much about.

For instance, the ’23 Mercedes EQE this writer test drove recently. It can get to 60 MPH in about 5 seconds, which is quicker than most V8 muscle cars of the ’60s and ’70s. But its top speed is only 130 MPH, which is a speed practically any modern car can reach or come close to reaching, given enough time. Even a Prius – regularly mocked for being not-quick – can get to about 120 if you give it enough road to make it there.

I know – because I did.

I also know what the Benz didn’t. As well as other EVs I have test driven. I am able to convey expert testimony regarding these vehicles as I have test driven thousands of new vehicles over the 30-plus years that I have been test-driving new vehicles. I can personally attest to what is quick – and fast.

Or one – but not the other.

The muscle cars of the past were pretty quick. But most of them were not very fast. They accelerated forcefully from a standstill. But they were slowed down by their gearing. Most of the old muscle cars had three or four speed transmissions – and axle ratios designed to give maximum leverage from a standing start. That is why classic muscle cars always touted how quick they were – 0-60 and through the quarter-mile. You rarely heard their manufacturers brag about how fast they were – because they usually weren’t.

By 100 MPH, a 3.73 rear axle gear combined with a three or four speed transmission without any overdrive gears typically resulted in an engine that was already revving not far from its redline, the point after which it was likely to blow up if you kept on revving it. You might be able to get it going a little faster, but usually not much. Most were at redline – in top gear – by the time the speedometer read 125 or so.

You could go faster – by giving up going quicker. This was done by pairing the three or four speed transmission with a “taller” axle ratio that reduced engine RPM at high speeds. A given car with a top speed of say 125 MPH with a 3.73 rear axle ratio might be able to hit 140 with a 2.41 axle (assuming enough power). But it would no longer get to 60 in 5 seconds.

It would be slower off the line.

It needed more time to get up to speed.

EVs are different, but also similar in that the reason they’re able to accelerate quickly has to do with the thing that makes them slow down. They have powerful electric motors fed by very heavy electric batteries. The batteries provide the power source for the motors – but they also weigh down the vehicle. It takes more power to move a heavier object; this is basic physics. And it takes more power to keep a heavier vehicle moving, too.

A heavy vehicle can be fast, no doubt – but because it uses up more power (energy) to go fast, it will not go fast for as long. Try driving an EV at 80 or 90 MPH for any length of time and see what happens to the range. I have done this – and so I know what happens to the range. I also know what happens when you get up to speed quickly. It is the same thing that happens when you maintain high speed.

Going fast can also create excess heat – which is not only bad for EV batteries (and electric motors) it can be dangerous, in that it increases the risk of a fire. Cars with engines get hot, too – but the heat is less a threat because the fuel (gas) doesn’t heat up as a result of rapid/repeated acceleration or high-speed driving. It just sloshes around in the tank. In fact, the fuel (in a modern, fuel-injected vehicle) cools the fuel pump, which is part of the reason why it is often located inside the gas tank of a modern, fuel-injected car.

Some EVs – Ford’s Mustang Mach e, for instance – will power down the motor after a burst of acceleration (or even during it) in order to keep things cooler. And every EV I’ve test driven – which is a lot of them – begins to feel draggy after it has accelerated quickly from a stop. The “plaid” and “ludicrous” speed wanes as speed increases.

That’s also true as regards non-electric cars. But most of them are still faster – because they’re not weighed down. Don’t believe me?

As the Toothless Man said, why don’t you try it and see?

. . .

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90 COMMENTS

  1. Going “fast” in a straight line is boring as hell. Flat-out through The Dip at the old Road Atlanta, on the other hand…

  2. EV’s were marketed as fast….that is very misleading disinformation. All they talk about is 0 to 60 times which tell you nothing.

    Ferrari does not talk about 0 to 60 mph times, they only talk about lap times, the only meaningful measure.

    Compared to performance ice powered cars EV’s have slow lap times, because they are far too heavy.

    The quickest cars in the world usually weigh 2000 lb or less, a modern 3000 lb to 4500 lb supercar/hypercar will never be as fast, you can’t overcome that much extra weight,these batteries weigh from 1000 lb to 1800 lb.

    To overcome the weight they add huge hp, this makes the car unstable so they control it with, stabilize it with AI, computers, they drive the car you don’t. These aren’t driver’s cars you are just along for the ride….

    In 1961 F1 cars weighed 450 kg 990 lb,

    in 2022 F1 cars weighed 700 kg. 1540 lb.

    The Porsche 919 hybrid EVO 850 kg 1873 lb

    Porsche 917 30 845 kg 1863 lb.

    Double A fuel dragster about 1400 lb.

    The answer? Buy an ultralight like a Super 7, or a Super 7 clone, around 1200 lb. and totally analog no driver assists…you have to drive it, and more fun then any other car.
    Over weight EV’s = no fun….

    • Here is a small light car that is very cool….

      Always one of the most spectacular HillClimb events of the year, Buzetski Dani in Croatia featured once again a tremendous entrylist, filled with an incredible amount of proper Monsters, making for a incredible selection of machines for the final Top 10 list.

      With 3 Lancer Evolution models, all over 600Hp, a 500 hp 911 GT3 from Porsche and 570 hp Ferrari GT3, 740Hp Seat Léon R32 Turbo, Renault RS01 600 hp, BMW M3 540 hp, 450 hp Lotus Elise,

      at the very Top we saw 2 of absolute fastest Monsters in Europe: Dan Michl´s famous 450 hp Lotus Elise V8 and Manuel Dondi in his frantic 320 hp FIAT X1/9 Lampredi 9000 rpm twin cam hemi 2.0 lt 4 cylinder….

      Fiat X1/9 hillclimb car with a 2 litre 320 hp na 9000 rpm Lampredi twin cam hemi engine …670 kg/1500 lb…has best time of the day… 4:51:108…quicker then all the other cars…..lightest car…..lightness matters…ask Colin Chapman…

      Lampredi 4 cylinder twin cam hemi, best 4 cylinder engine in the world…..designed by Ferrari engine designer Aurelio Lampredi….a Ferrari designer designed engine in your X1/9….

      see at 9:30 in video….
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J9ipUEWlCqs

      Fiat X1/9 hillclimb car with a 2 litre 320 hp na 9000 rpm Lampredi twin cam hemi engine …670 kg/1500 lb…has best time of the day… 4:51:108…quicker then the 450 hp Lotus Elise V8 or the 500 hp GT3 from Porsche and the 570 hp Ferrari GT3,…weight matters…lightness wins…ask Chapman…

    • Hi Anon,

      Your point is well-taken. When motorcycle people talk about “fast” they mean a rider who can hustle a bike through the curves (as on a road-race course) quickly. This requires a good rider and a light, agile bike. There is reason why Harleys don’t usually win road race events, irrespective of how “fast” their riders are!

    • LMAO…sure…the EV can go zero to sixty in record time. And it will use up half of the already sh**y range in the process. The devil always was in the details

      • Richard,

        You’re someone who does not consider high-speed driving fun; ergo you have disqualified yourself from offering an opinion about performance cars.

        • Good grief who would not find drive fast to be fun? I find it quite thrilling actually. The risk of getting caught…and in my neck of the woods, the danger of Bullwinkle stepping out of nowhere…it really gets the adrenaline pumping, hehe. Especially if you are driving a vehicle that is made to go fast. Aaah…now that brings up a few pleasant memories Eric….

        • Does an alarm go off when I post a comment so you can immediately stop everything you are doing give me a hard time? If 130mph is not fast enough for you, then you are a speed demon with a death wish.

          • Richard,

            I do not “give you a hard time.” I point out that you have a habit of pedantic quibbling (and missing the point) that is exhausting. You also have this very annoying tendency of purveying your subjective opinions as if they were objective facts.

            • Richards basic flaw. He exaggerates his opinion into dogma. Much like Greta. It’s a pity, since I often agree with his opinion. If I don’t, per Richard, I’m wrong.

          • Richard writes:

            “If 130mph is not fast enough for you, then you are a speed demon with a death wish.”

            So is 120 ok? How about 100? What arbitrary velocity maximum meets with your arbitrary approval?

            There are Clovers who think anything faster than the speed limit – whatever it is – is “too fast.” Are you one of those?

            I enjoy driving fast; I often drive very fast. But if I have a “death wish,” I’m pretty god-damned bad figuring out how to get my wish, eh?

            By the way: Time permitting, I plan to take my very fast sport bike out today. I will try to get it over 170 – just for you.

            • The problem with high speed driving in an area where other people are driving is that they are not expecting something moving that fast and the result could be tragic. It’s one thing to risk your own life, that’s your choice but on public roads you are putting others at risk and that is irresponsible. The idea that you don’t like the speed limit is not an excuse to break the law. That activity should be confined to tracks or private property.

              • Cashy,

                You seem to think the speed limit is a divine totem of some kind.

                In fact, it is – at best – a dumbed-down/one-size-fits-all legally decreed, maximum-permitted velocity. It is not a moral standard or even a “safety” standard. There is no “problem with high speed driving,” as you put it -because what is “high speed driving”? Why, it is faster than whatever someone thinks (or the sign says) is “high speed.” Some people think 70 is “high speed.” Others, 55. It is very subjective. Some people are so inattentive and poorly skilled that they are – as Nader put it – unsafe at any speed. Others are attentive and skilled and can drive much faster than the speed limit without causing any problems.

                If someone loses control and wrecks, speed isn’t the problem. It is the loss of control. Focusing on that – the loss of control – is an objective standard. You either did – or didn’t. If you didn’t, what is the problem? Some will say: But you might have lost control because you were going “too fast.”

                This is the reason why the country has become a prison full of neurotics and busybodies easily controlled by tyrants – who pledge to “keep them safe.”

                • Ugh, driving 70, or even 80 or more in Eastern Montana, where it is flat as hell, will still feel like you are going nowhere fast. There is no way in hell that anyone is going to go the speed limit out there in BFE for the likes of you…..

                    • I couldn’t care less what Cashy thinks. He would be the same driver in these parts that would have a line of cars behind him because he is too damned rude to pull over. If he wants to be safe, he should move to a communist country, where he can be rest-assured that daddy government will keep him safe. And by force, and at the barrel of a gun, necessary.

                    • Indeed, Shadow!

                      The problem with communists isn’t communism. It is that they are not content to be communists themselves – and leave the rest of us out of it.

                • The speed limit is what people expect their fellow drivers to be driving at (or close). Too much faster or slower is a hazard. There are rules of the road that you should follow to limit accidents. What other rules do you wish to ignore? Driving on the right side of the road, stopping at stop signs? I understand you want to drive fast but your desire is secondary to the desire of people that expect the rules to be followed. Do you think it’s a good idea for a car guy to encourage law breaking in a car!

                  • Cashy,

                    Why would I give a flip about what random strangers “expect?” These random strangers also “expected” me (and others) to wear an idiotic rag over my face. Fuck that. Fuck them, too.

                    “What other rules do you wish to ignore?”

                    All that I judge to be stupid or tyrannical. For example, coming to a complete stop at a stop sign just because there’s a sign when it’s clear there’s no traffic. It wastes time and energy.

                    And “buckle up laws,” which are like “eat your broccoli” laws in that they are busybody laws and busybodies can go fuck themselves.

                    “Do you think it’s a good idea for a car guy to encourage law breaking in a car!”

                    Yes, absolutely. See comments above.

                    • There was no law that you had to wear a face mask. That was something required by the property owners of the places that required it.

                      I’m not going to rehash the seat belt argument because I don’t care if you risk your own life. But speed limits and other traffic laws are not stupid or tyrannical, they are necessary for the safe operation of vehicles. I do not want me or mine at risk because you choose to ignore the law. If you do you should be ticketed and fined and if you were to keep on breaking the law your license should be suspended and if that doesn’t keep your unsafe ass off the road then jailed! That’s how a civil society works. We don’t live in Libertopia or Anarchyville where you get to choose which laws apply to you and which don’t.

                    • Cashy,

                      “There was no law that you had to wear a face mask.”

                      No, there were “mandates” that were enforced as if they had been laws. Why do you defend this evil, ugly business? Probably because you did wear the idiotic “mask.” Am I right? Be honest.

                      “But speed limits and other traffic laws are not stupid or tyrannical…” And yet I have just explained why they are. Can you explain why it is not stupid to mindlessly obey a law just because it is “the law”? Do you sit like a brain-dead idiot at a red light that never turns green? How many cycles do you wait before you go? Or do you actually sit there all night long?

                      You remind me of the Ronnie Cox character in Deliverance who whines “it’s the law!” when Burt and Jon Vought urge disposing of the raping redneck’s body – i.e., shoot, shovel and shut up – rather than file a police report.

                      “I do not want me or mine at risk because you choose to ignore the law.”

                      The same was said in re demanding people wear “masks.” Your fears aren’t binding upon me or anyone else. Get therapy to deal with your fears.

                      Finally: “my unsafe ass” hasn’t so much as scratched paint in 30-plus years. Can you say the same?

                      Be honest.

                    • Sorry, Cashy, but you stating that we were not obligated to wear a face mask are wrong. The Coonman (then current governor of VA) dictated on Memorial Day weekend that all businesses had to require the wearing of diapers to enter through their doors. Did my business follow it? No way in hell. Actually, I wouldn’t even put out hand sanitizer.

                      My local butcher had to sell meat to me on the side because I refused to mask up for an outside farmer’s market. This was not decided by individual or businesses, but state bureaucrats.

          • You have no business, Richard, lecturing anyone on how fast anyone needs to go, the kind of gun you think they are allowed to possess, the amount of bullets in a magazine you think one is allowed to have…or whether you think I am allowed to have that juicy steak instead of being forced to eat bugs and drinking piss for the earth. Give you a hard time? Waaaah…..

      • Richard,

        EVs are “fun” in the way that riding a high-speed elevator is “fun.” In both, you get in and – basically – push a button and get taken for a ride.

        It gets old, fast.

        • What’s the difference in an EV going fast and an ICE with an automatic going fast? You aren’t doing anything but steering and braking. If you like to go fast isn’t it the same thing? It sounds like you just don’t like EV’s.

          • Cashy,

            There are several differences:

            The EV goes fast briefly. It also goes fast boringly. There’s no sound, very little feel. Just anodyne forward thrust, which wanes after the initial launch. And then watch the range plummet.

            All EVs have the same personality; i.e., none.

            A car with an engine (“ICE” is fag talk) makes its own unique sounds; some of these are glorious (e.g., the Challenger Black Ghost’s supercharged Hemi). The shifting up and down adds more sensory input; in a powerful car – like the Ghost – the tires skitter and leave black marks on the pavement on the 1-2 and 2-3 upshift.

            It doesn’t sound “like I just don’t like EVs.”

            I loathe them.

  3. There’s the old saying about “having your lunch and eating it too”…..and other analogous stories and parables, like the Little Mermaid. The sea witch would replace her tail fin with legs so she could go out onto land, but she had to give up her voice in that trade.
    In nature, things are very much the same. Animals that are large, powerful and heavy can run very fast over short distances, but smaller, lighter creatures can carry on running for vast distances, albeit at less than top speed. An elephant can easily outrun the fastest humans but only over a short distance. And stuff made by humans is also subject to these same laws of physics and scientific realities.
    To get breakneck acceleration, EVs require a massive battery, which slows them down in lots of other ways. Forget the top speeds…even hauling that much excess weight will ding range even at higher (above limit) freeway speeds, not to mention ascending hills. And unlike an EV, at least an elephant is able to do useful things with its bulk – like pushing down trees for food and repelling predators. But what good is the EV’s weight? Increasing the severity of a crash? Eating thru tires? Giving the roads an extra pounding?

    So the question would be is why lug around such a massive battery when its only plus is being able to make the vehicle it is in accelerate quickly? One selling point and the rest is all detrimental….

    • “One selling point and the rest is all detrimental….”

      While that is true, and sad, there are a lot of people who think EVs are necessary to save our planet. And that includes people with very high IQs. One such person is my next door neighbor, who extremely bright on a number of subjects, except one: CO2. He has a huge organic garden, and brings us free vegetables, yet does not even know the relationship of CO2 and plants. I limit my debate with him on climate change because he is nice neighbor, but a lost cause. Of course he drives a Toyota Prius with the license plate “OilsGone”. I know he has a BS degree in computer engineering and a masters degree in something related to alternative energy. He also does alternative energy consulting part time.

      • “…there are a lot of people who think EVs are necessary to save our planet.”

        I don’t believe the word “think” in that sentence is appropriate.

  4. I had a conversation with Chat GPT about hysteresis and eddy current loss in electric motors. I was under the impression that there was a hard limit to a motor’s rotational speed due to the magnetic field breaking down. I was close but it turns out to be more practical than theoretical…

    Sure, here’s a summary of our conversation:

    1. You inquired about how hysteresis affects the top rotational speed of an electric motor. I explained that hysteresis doesn’t directly influence the top rotational speed. Instead, it leads to energy loss known as hysteresis loss, which contributes to the motor’s efficiency and operating temperature. The top speed of a motor is more directly related to factors such as power supply frequency, motor design, load characteristics, and power supply voltage and current.

    2. We then discussed how hysteresis loss is affected by the motor’s rotational speed. I explained that hysteresis loss is primarily determined by the frequency of magnetic field changes in the motor’s core, rather than the rotational speed. However, in systems where frequency is adjusted to control motor speed (such as Variable Frequency Drives), an increase in frequency (and thus motor speed) will result in more frequent magnetization and demagnetization of the core material, leading to increased hysteresis loss.

    3. You further asked if there’s an upper limit to motor speed due to magnetic field hysteresis. I explained that while there isn’t a hard speed limit imposed by hysteresis, the increased hysteresis losses at higher frequencies can indirectly limit how fast a motor can feasibly and safely operate due to thermal and efficiency considerations.

    4. Lastly, we discussed eddy current losses and their relation to motor speed. Eddy current losses, like hysteresis losses, increase with the frequency of the alternating magnetic field and not directly with the motor’s rotational speed. In high-speed motors where frequency is adjusted to control speed, these losses become a significant concern due to the thermal management challenges and decrease in overall efficiency.

    So, while neither hysteresis nor eddy current losses directly limit a motor’s speed, they are critical considerations for the motor’s efficiency, thermal management, and safe operation, especially at high frequencies/speeds.

  5. I don’t think most people care about top speed as there are so few chances to test that while 0-60 is much more popular as you can at least use that once in a while.

    Is any one dragging these cars? I know there are problems in the inner city with kids racing in areas late at night. You’d figure someone with one if these EV rockets would blow everyone’s doors off. A 0-60 or quarter mile list of the faster cars, ICE and EV would be interesting.

    • I don’t know about EVs, but in Baltimore most of the kids seem to prefer dirt bikes and quads to race around the city (not to mention that the former are illegal in the city). My guess is that dirt bikes make it far easier to lose the cops….in fact, they generally don’t even bother to try chasing them.
      Now some kids will commandeer an intersection and do burn outs in cars, but I’m not sure what an EV (no matter how quick) would do in that situation. Also, kids can acquire and fix up an old beater far easier than they can get a hold of a fancy, pricey EV. Unless of course they steal one….

    • I had to “drag” a car car today. A 1964 Ford F-100. I dragged it 100+ miles. Took 5 hours. It was a lot of fun. The car is in great shape, 70K miles, not documentation other han title, but a sweet acquisition.

  6. Places here in Az where people routinely drive 100MPH +or- Richard. I’ll live wherever I want, and drive as fast as I want, thanks. Been to Germany, driven on the Autobahn, wouldn’t want to live there. Many Karens and Nancys just like here, which in a way is what you’re being.

    You say risky and stupid with such fervent certainty I almost believe it. You could be an expert witness for GovCo. For most drivers, on most roads, 130 probably is risky and stupid. Still, I don’t need the Government or one of her Pretorians to hold my hand. The arguments behind what should and shouldn’t be allowed are the same for guns as they are for speed.

    No shortage of reasons why EVs are such fails. I do agree with you that lack of top end speed isn’t the best argument against EVs. However, since that is their only selling point it is fair game.

  7. If you are at Bear’s Tooth Pass in Montana, the descent will be from 10,000 feet down to and into Wyoming which is 5000 feet plus in elevation.

    In an EV with a neutral, you can possibly make 200 mph in a more or less free fall mode. It’ll be like a boxcar derby, lots of fun. har

    Be extra careful on the 7 percent grade. You’ll be at Mammoth Hot Springs soon enough.

    You can cool the battery at 200 mph.

    Forget the EV and go by an ICE vehicle. You will be happy.

    If you have a newer older vehicle, be sure to change the cabin filters, makes a big difference in how the blower motor pushes the air inside you car.

    • … go buy an ICE vehicle. Simple misspellings are frustrating.

      Change the cabin filters in your car.

      Corrected, not a bot for sure.

  8. Yes I was wondering if the German EV’s are made for higher top speeds that may be needed on the autobahn. I haven’t been there in a while but when I was you needed a car that could go 150km+ or else you were going to be in peoples way.

  9. How many lies will the Biden Thing and the media continue peddling about EVs, such as the one that mass adoption of EVs will save the planet. Some of the claims about EVs sound awfully similar to the claims that were made about a certain experimental pharma product, such as the claim that mass vaccination would “End COVID”.

    • Yes, I am sure the recent EVs catching on fire is saving the planet. I would love to see them teyingnto explain that one….

      • So far EV fires per 100,000 miles driven have been much lower than ICE fires. And hybrid fires are much higher than ICE fires per 100,000 miles driven.

        Where EVs have set new fire records is:

        — Intensity of EV fires.
        A retired fireman told me that he was very happy to have retired before ever fighting an EV fire or having to get a cat out of a tree. He was joking about the cat, but not the EV fires.

        — EV’s ability to catch fire while the vehicle is not moving. Spontaneous combustion unrelated to an accident, or a lack of maintenance. I’m not an EV engineer, but I suspect using a few thousand tiny batteries to create one big battery is Rube Goldberg (bad) engineering, if long term reliability is your goal.

        I suspect solid state batteries would be safer … but there is no standardized material currently used in their manufacturing process, and no standardized manufacturing process. This makes them hard to mass produce. Some estimates put Solid State batteries at three to four times the price of traditional lithium-ion batteries. So they are not ready for prime time yet.

        It has been known for over a century that batteries were the weak link for EVs, but government bureaucrats could not care less about science and engineering.

  10. Eric, question here? Have you tried to do a power burnout in any of the EVs? I know any of the pony cars are easy to do with the traction control turned off. Even if it does, a motor humming doesn’t match the adrenaline of a high performance engine reving.

  11. ‘excess heat … is bad for EV batteries’ — eric

    Sittin’ with my peeps at the trailhead yesterday in the hot, hot sun, a black Tesla (parked with no one inside) was audibly roaring as its cooling fans struggled to keep the battery temperature from rising into the red zone.

    A guy next to me, a wrench at the local motorwerks, commented on the ludicrosity [sic] of the battery kicking on a battery-powered blower to cool itself. A certain circularity is apparent here.

    Maybe Eeeeelon could incorporate solar panels into the roof for them hot days, sort of like the Aptera EeeVee (“up to 40 miles a day of free driving powered by the sun”).

    Lemme tell you — the Aptera is a scam on a par with the 100 mpg carburetor of yore. Its energy input from solar panels might be enough to run the infotainment system … but not enough to push a vehicle around.

    Why don’t you try it and see? Oops, you can’t — the Aptera is just an artist’s rendering for now. 🙁

    • It’s things like that (the Tesla struggling to not overheat its battery while not even moving) that really deepen the appreciation of the ICE vehicle. We had temps of 95 degrees + and heat indexes pushing 105-110 late last week in my area. And I went to work in my Dodge Ram and parked it in the hot sun. I cracked the windows only for my own comfort, so it wouldn’t take the AC as long to cool down the cab when it was time to leave. And there sat my truck silently, in the blazing heat, having no need to keep any part of it any cooler than the surrounding air. And then when I go home, I start the engine, along with its fan and coolant system, and fire up the AC to cool me off. The engine stays at its desired temp, as do I, all without any sort of massive drain on my driving range or excessive fuel use. Plus, the Hemi engine still has plenty of power when I need it.

      The things that many take for granted, that is, until faced with an alterative (that is being forced on us) that is sorely lacking in so many ways!

  12. Hi Eric! –

    It is interesting that you compare EVs and rear-end gear ratios. It is true that EVs are quick, but not fast. And it is true that if one wants to accelerate quicker in a rear-drive car, a numerically high ring & pinion will do that, but without extra trans gears, the engine will top out quickly too. I guess a “happy medium” would be something in the 3.50 – 3.75 range, regardless of what type of differential the vehicle has.

    Where I am at a loss is swapping out ring & pinion gear sets. Oh yeah, it’s easy to switch out a “chunk” that’s already set up with a different ratio, but measuring backlash, shims and other stuff is foreign to me. One of these days I have to have someone show me how to do it. Or I’ll just accept the 3.91s in my 8 3/4.

  13. Regular heckler here:

    Of all the reasons I have read about for criticizing EVs in the past few years, and there ae many, having a top speed of ‘only’ 130mph is, by far, the most ridiculous and reason of them all.

      • Why Eric, it’s ridiculous because Richard thinks so. He often presents his own personal conclusions as the word of “God”.

        • Sorry to disappoint you Mr. Kable, but I have been an atheist for 60 years. I do, however, believe there are intelligent aliens on the planet Uranus.

          • Richard. So now we know you are a godless/communist/rationalist/person without anything to hang your soul on. You think it’s one and done. I am sorry for you and will pray for the soul you believe you do not have, “may it not rest in hell”. We can talk again in the next stage of being. Peace.

      • Maybe I am wrong, but that is not at the top of my list of probabilities.
        Not even in my top three.

        Dearborn, Michigan
        December 20, 2024
        Fox Business Breaking News

        Ford Motor Declares Bankruptcy: CEO Resigns

        In an exclusive interview with Fox Business News, Ford CEO Englebert Lipshitz Ford, apologized for ignoring the EV speed problem. “I had no idea so many customers would care that our EVs could not exceed 130mph. Our engineers told me that in 2023, and I just laughed at them”.

        When contacted by Fox Business News, world renowned auto industry consultant EP, a legend in his own mind, revealed that he recognized the EV speed problem in a July 2023 online article. As you can see in this recent photo, EP is wearing a mask to disguise his identity, after numerous death threats from unemployed Ford engineers blaming him for revealing this huge EV flaw and inciting the public. In addition, the Biden Justice Department is investigating EP, although they refuse to reveal for what.

        Richard Greene
        Fox Business News
        At Large …
        and getting larger.

        • Richard,

          Whether I am a “legend in my own mind” is just a trite personal attack; it has no bearing on the point I made. EVs tout their performance. I have pointed out their performance is weak. In other words. EVs don’t even deliver on the one thing they supposedly excel at.

          Do you get it yet?

          • So far, EV manufacturers do NOT tout their EV top speed, cornering ability or braking anility. All three are part of “performance” along with acceleration and maximum distance on a full charge.

            They tout acceleration often, and maybe sometimes mention the lower center of gravity. The lower center of gravity in EVs is due to the placement of the battery pack, typically located on the bottom of the car. This reduces the risk of tipping or rolling over, even in a high-speed collision. .. but ‘better in a collision’ does not make for good advertising copy, even if you could prove it.

            A lower center of gravity has the potential for better cornering, offset by more weight for the batteries. More weight has the potential for longer braking distances.

            But the ONLT aspect of performance I’ve seen claimed is acceleration.

            There have been brief mentions of lower top speed for EVs since 2018 that I can locate, but usually one sentence in an article, with no specific mph numbers.

            • Richard,

              They tout performance – and a measure of that is how fast they go. They dissemble when they tout acceleration only – because it is misleading. Because it is merely one aspect of performance. The point being that – once again – half-truths are being peddled about EVs.

              I aim to give folks the straight dope.

              • To your credit, EP, you DO write honest EV reviews … but I still think a 130mph top speed would not turn away many potential EV buyers.

                I recommend anti-EV articles on my blog every day, and have noticed the first change of mood about EVs in several years: The articles on EVs are not almost all EV cheerleading these days. In the past, the only criticism of EVs was from people or journalists who tried long trips with an EV. Their “adventures” all reminded me of the movie “Planes, Trains and Automobiles”. Always ending with :nwver again”.

                And your EV reviews, which match what EV engineers say about the EVs they are developing.

                My Dad, a retired electrician, spent over 30 years of his life advocating for EVs, but at least he was honest enough to admit the batteries were no good (but of course they would be better in 10 years). I would respond by saying if the EV batteries are no good, then EVs are no good too. This debate continued, on and off, for decades.

          • “Whether I am a “legend in my own mind” is just a trite personal attack;”

            It is a violation of internet rule 4c** to disagree with an author and NOT include a trite character attack in your comment. That is an internet tradition.

            Al “I invented the internet” Gore’s Book of Internet Rules

    • Yes I agree. I’d much rather see a less expensive version with lower top speeds then what they are making now. Where can you go 130 mph? Montana? I don’t live there. When is the last time anyone went over 85 for any length of time? Fleeing the scene of a crime doesn’t count.

          • Hi Richard,

            Non sequitur!

            Look, the point is that EVs tout performance. If they don’t deliver it, then what is the point of being powerful? To strut around like someone wearing a huge codpiece?

            I have been trying to point out the hypocrisy (among other things) of EVs – and those who buy them. Ostensibly, we must have them – must be forced into them – because there is a “crisis.” Well, if so, then how is it morally justifiable to tout gratuitous wastage of energy and resources in order to tout performance – which is an attribute no one “needs”?

            If there is in fact a “crisis,” then only the bare minimum necessary ought to be allowed – right?

            • In the AAA Magazine Fall edition, they bring up the fast acceleration of BEV’s but ask whether the braking is up to snuff for these heavier vehicles, especially for the SUV’s.

            • EVs have a ridiculous number of faults. I have recommended hundreds of anti-EV articles on my blog in the past few years. But not being able to exceed 130mph is a minor fault. If a fault at all. I can’t imagine many people refusing to buy an EV simply because it can not exceed 130mph.

              • Richard,

                You are often doggedly obtuse. Once again: EVs tout performance. This is what those who buy them brag about. Yet the truth is they don’t perform that well – as I have carefully explained. Whether you think “130” is enough – and more, too much – is like saying that a 4×4 truck with 400 horsepower, locking diffs and bead-locked 31 inch tires is “too much.” Maybe it is – for you. But rest assured, such things are why people who buy vehicles like that buy vehicles like that.

                How many people who buy a Corvette would buy one if its top speed were only slightly higher than that of a Prius?

            • EVs are not advertised as sports car. I think (at least in this scenario) the EV has promoted what they do best – acceleration. They are fast off the light. Now, if we are assessing at 100 km the Porsche 911, the 918 Spyder, the Lamborghini Huracan, and Bugatti have them by the balls.

              With the exception of the Tesla Plaid (which Eric mentioned above) are the other EVs promoting speed? A vehicle’s performance can attribute to a number of factors. I just noticed this morning that my good old Ford F250 V8 has a maximum speed of 80 mph on the speedometer. She starts getting shaky around 65 mph. That doesn’t mean she doesn’t perform well. She is torquey, has a great towing capacity, and is reliable. She just isn’t fast.

              Performance can many a number of things depending on the vehicle. EVs are not pretending to be race cars…and they aren’t. We all know that a continuous high speed will drain the battery in about 15 minutes. The electric vehicle is for the guy (or girl) who just wants that quick surge of acceleration off the light to beat the guy next to them. The EV does this. Other than that there isn’t a lot going for it.

              • Hi RG,

                Yeah, but what annoys me is the dissembling. EV fanbois love to talk up how fast their EVs are.And yet, they’re not really. Hell, my ancient Trans-Am is probably faster than most of them in that it could probably hit 150 and maybe more given the mods I have done to it. Not that I’d do that on BFG Radial T/A tires, of course!

        • Richard,

          You keep missing the point…

          And: A vehicle that tops out at 130 is getting near the edge of its performance envelope at 100. It is “running out of steam” by that point. As opposed to something like the BMW M2 I’m driving right now – or the Challenger I was a few weeks ago. 100 for them is third gear and just getting going.

          • “A vehicle that tops out at 130 is getting near the edge of its performance envelope at 100. It is “running out of steam” by that point.”

            To use a scientific term, that there claim is baloney.

            An EV WOULD be quickly running out of range at 100mph, but NOT steam.

            “According to Geotab, the average EV’s range is almost halved — a 45-per-cent reduction compared to its optimum at 30 km/h (18mph) — when travelling at 125 kilometres an hour (125mph), assuming it could reach 125mph.”

            “While the average diesel, in our testing, is down less than 20 per cent from its maximum efficiency”

      • Wherever you want if you have the balls to do it. Going faster than 100 is pretty scary on ANY road. My top end was 150 when I was 17 driving down a local road showing off to the girl that was in the passenger seat. A 1966 Buick LeSabre with I think a large engine (454?). It was a lot of fun.

        Unfortunately a car going in the opposite direction knew me and I was busted. My parents were unhappy, I did not admit to the actual speed, just “fast”. But boy it was wild going 150. I would not do it today. My reactions and tolerance for danger was better then, but it was fun.

    • 130 MPH is not safe and effective eh Richard, because our GovCo overlords told us so. That kind of thinking would put you in good stead with gun grabblers everywhere. After all who needs a Springfield Armory M-14? A rifle capable of putting an unacceptable number of hi calibre rounds downrange fast and accurately should be frowned upon. Can confirm, that kind of tracks with boomer Neo=con thinking.

      • Texans are familiar with driving on roadways with 70 or 75 mph speed limits. There are even a few sections of highways where 80 mph is the maximum speed. The fastest posted speed limit in the country of 85 mph is only found in a certain stretch of Texas highway.

        130mph is illegal and not even close to the highest legal speed limit in the US of 85mph

        130 mph is risky

        130 mph is stupid

        Move to Germany if you want to drive faster than 130 mph.

        And this subject has nothing to do with guns.

        The failure of an EV to exceed 130 mph is the worst reason to criticize EVs in the history of the world. Maybe even our whole galaxy?

        • Whatever. EV’s still suck and likely always will. They will be declared toxic waste soon enough, and why not? They already figure that Li batteries are just that. There are very few reasons to even own one. All this pie in the sky stuff is just silly and they aren’t practical at all. Maybe if someone makes a nuclear powered one, I’ll have a look. Hybrids are a different story altogether.

          • “EV’s still suck and likely always will.”

            That is true today, but better batteries are coming in ten years … and have been coming in ten years, for the past century, along with fusion power.

        • Richard. Have you ever driven fast? 120 even on I-75 between Bay City and Standish on a Tuesday/Wednesday in the fall. 30 mile straight shot, balls to the walls!

        • “The failure of an EV to exceed 130 mph is the worst reason to criticize EVs”
          But it never the less is one.

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