Tesla – and GM – Finally Admit It

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GM – and Tesla – just publicly admitted that they can’t sell electric cars. Or rather, they need your help – via Uncle.

To pay people $7,500 each to “buy” their electric cars.

To be paid by those who pay the taxes which will make up for the taxes not collected from the people who “buy” electric cars. This is the wealth transfer scheme styled “electric car tax credits.”

They have been around for years – and may be coming back – because electric cars have pull rather than range.

Great sums of money were expended to extract great sums of money – via the tax code, which was adjusted to give preferential treatment to the purchasers of electric cars by making electric cars seem more affordable than they are, in fact.

In order to create the fiction of a “market” for electric cars, where none – or very little – actually existed.

If that were not the case, then why the need to pay people to “buy” them? In every other case of such massive discounting – an industry term –  the need to apply such discounts is taken as evidence of the car being discounted being a flop.

Get rid of them by whatever means necessary – as by giving them away –  and then build no more.

The Aztek being a for-instance. Imagine being paid to buy one. Of course, the difference with EVs is that instead of GM paying you to buy an Aztek, the government is making someone else pay for your electric Aztek.

Or rather, your neighbor’s electric Aztek.

No one would abide such a thing, much less laud such a thing. How come almost no one is questioning this thing?

That question is hardly ever raised – much less answered. Probably because of the answer. Electric cars are the Azteks of our time, but worse. And unlike the Aztek, which was merely ugly – electric cars are evil. A kind of cancer that is not only metastasizing but being encouraged to metastasize.

They don’t go far – and they cost far more than most people are willing to pay for them – and accordingly, most won’t pay for them, if the cost isn’t reduced somehow.

As by making someone else pay for part of the cost of them – the evil part. Or at least part of the evil part.

Since electric cars are very costly – even with the subsidy – it is generally wealthy people who buy electric cars, as an indulgence – by definition, since they aren’t economical.

And to signal their virtue.

It is generally the not-wealthy who don’t buy them – not being able to afford expensive indulgences – but who do pay the full freight of what are styled “their” taxes  – which help finance the loss of taxes paid by the affluent, to help them afford their still-expensive electric car indulgences.

Of course, Tesla – the head bird wetting its beak – claimed it didn’t need the assistance of government pull to “sell” its electric cars, probably because of what it implies about the mass-market viability of electric cars without the pull.

The problem is that Tesla has never been able to make any money selling electric cars. It takes money, selling “credits” for building them to other car companies, which are under duress to buy them in order to meet their government-required quota for either building a certain number of “zero emissions” cars themselves or handing over money to Tesla in exchange for “credit” equivalent to building them.

When the $7,500 tax credit went away – which happens when a production threshold of 200,000 electric cars made is reached – it becomes much harder to sell more electric cars because now people have to pay the full cost, rather than offload a large chunk of the cost.

This has made Tesla more reliant on the taking of cash in exchange for “credits” to keep itself in “business” – in air quotes to emphasize the etymological absurdity of a “business” that is unable to sell its products on their merits.

But the problem now is that Tesla isn’t the only company building lots of electric cars for which there isn’t a natural market.

GM – and other big car companies – have gone all-in on electric cars – the making of them, in anticipation of a vast “market” for them, created by pull. By the same species of “zero emissions” and similar “green” government mandates that have confected a “market” for Elon’s cars  . . . and his “credits.”

Only more so, now that Joe has been (s)elected and has promised to mandate an even larger “market.”

It is precisely why every car company is now making electric cars – and promises to make more.

But when GM and the others are making the required number of electric cars themselves – irrespective of the actual market for them – they no longer needs to pay Elon Musk to make them, instead. Which leaves Elon with a money problem – and GM (and the others) with a sales problem.

The pull of the mandates can cause lots of electric cars to be manufactured. Indeed, the gravitational force of pull can cause everyone making cars to make electric cars – because they have to.

But – so far – people do not have to buy them. 

So, they must be “helped” to “buy” them – using more of your money. GM and Tesla want the 200,000 car cap lifted, so that everyone who buys an electric car can make other people pay for them.

Assuming you pay what are styled “your”  taxes – and haven’t bought an electric car, yourself.

And the rest of the evil part? That part comes into play when people are forced to buy electric cars – because not-electric cars have been forced off the market, by the same “mandates” that are creating an artificial “market” for electric cars.

.  . .

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81 COMMENTS

  1. Hi Eric,

    I’d love to support you financially, but Paypal has bricked my account by demanding I have a US cell number, and not accepting the Hoogle number which can receive text messages. Mailing a check from South America is a fool’s errand. Will you ever be accepting cryptos? Not Bitcoin or Etherium; they’re almost useless at this point. They are several coins that can actually be sent quickly and cheaply.

      • I have no way to send BTC to an email address. That may be a Coinbase internal thing. I don’t know how others feel, but for me Coinbase is the equivalent of taking your car with 150,000 miles to the dealer for an oil change. And then there’s that saying: “not your keys, not your coins.” Setting up Exodus or Atomic wallets on your computer is simple matter; the key is to write down your seed phrase and store it safely (I keep mine on 3×5 cards in two safes in different buildings). With those words in order, you can restore your wallet at any time.

        Also, while I can send Bitcoin for “only” a dollar (“normal” fee is from $10-50) and it will probably get to you some day, a coin like Ripple/XRP or Stellar/XLM costs less than a penny to send and arrives in seconds. From inside your local wallet you can swap XLM for other cryptos if you want (and it ain’t nobody’s business but your own).

        You can research transaction fees for various coins here: https://bitinfocharts.com/bitcoin/

        I would suggest you set up a local wallet, and post XLM, XRP, DASH public addresses on your contribution page and see what happens. And look for things you can pay for in cryptos as the USD and other fiat currencies race in neck and neck towards total worthlessness. Cheers!

        • Hi Barry,

          This stuff is all Greek to me. I have a Coinbase account; my understanding was that people could send Bitcoin to it in c/o of Eric Peters or EPeters952@yahoo.com

          I only use my (very crappy) sail fawn for texting and calling. I don’t grok the rest!

          • Fair enough. I was talking about a desktop program; one of my hobbies is monitoring people’s facial expressions when I tell them I have a cell phone but it’s rarely turned on. Anyhoo, in Coinbase, under send-receive you can choose receive and then what coin you want to receive. I would suggest DASH, since it just involves one address, that will look something like XeXhfhxnbqjbtQALKMeZERaAx2hZo823U4. Post that here, I’ll send a small amount (transaction fee is under a penny; I can handle that), and let’s see if it works.

  2. Those behind the ransomware extortion plot are not playing fair.

    In a week, with no gas, all commerce along the eastern seaboard will be chaotic, best to begin to empty grocery store shelves sooner than later.

    Panick early.

  3. If they really care about mpg, they could get rid of all the surpentine belts and use electric powered oil & water pumps. And also run the oil pump before cranking the engine at startup to circulate the oil before the engine cranks — that would prolong the life of the engine therefore pollute less. Or, we could have electric cars if they’d stop suppressing free energy technology — then they’d have infinite range and wouldn’t even need to be charged.

    But they don’t really care about mpg or the environment — they’re all a bunch of insane people that should be in an asylum — and they pollute the planet alot.

    • Belts are surprisingly efficient. A well maintained bicycle chain (true, it’s not a belt) is something like 97% efficient. Belts can get close, as long as all the shaft bearings and pulleys roll freely and the belt line is kept straight. Moving power around with copper cables isn’t going to get you much closer, except when you introduce variable drive control. But then there’s the overhead of running the controller and the losses from the MOSFETs, and the added weight of high current low loss copper cables.

      • Okay, you might be right about that, thanks for the info. I’m not the most educated about engineering stuff. But I like the idea of not having a belt just for the simplicity of it and having one less part that wears out. I imagine not having a belt & pulleys would still save at least .5 mpg though, maybe even more.

  4. The elite hate, hate, hate the fact that the real marketplace prefers cheap gas, large vehicles and V8 engines.

    So it must be destroyed at all costs.

  5. Just look at Barra’s heinous language:

    “We’d like to see that [cap] lifted and let the marketplace decide and not penalize first movers.”

    Subjecting GM’s electric cars to the actual marketplace is the last things she wants.

    • Lifting that cap is the exact Opposite of letting the marketplace decide. The maeketplace has decided and 95% of it wants nothing to do with ev’s. Are these supposed ceo’s really this stupid or is it deliberate?

      • They are really this stupid.

        They get confused sometimes, and think that because their subordinates (usually) (appear to) comply with everything that comes out of their mouths, their customers will obviously do the same and like it.

        It doesn’t work that way. No, really, it doesn’t.

        CEOs are not God, they just think they are.

        • Hi Publius,

          Corporations aren’t so much “woke” as they are poltroonish. Above all, they – the people in charge – crave to be seen as “good citizens.” As defined by the “woke.”

  6. This whole electric car thing can not crash and burn soon enough. Just because a bunch morons mandate something doesn’t mean it`s going to work.

  7. Electric cars are charged with grid power. By the time you factor in transmission loss, it’s not any more efficient than gasoline engines. Saving the Earth? Bunk!

  8. I work with a bunch of automotive technology around self driving as part of my day job, so I’ve had the opportunity to discuss issues at length with some automotive engineers and mid-level management, and they’re living in an imaginary world, like the rest of us.

    As with the always-maskers, and vaccine-forcers, in the car industry, you have loud, delusional people who are pushing two things before they’re ready; electric cars, and self driving cars. Most of the engineers do as they’re told with the constraints they have, and grumble about it, but their job isn’t to question. The people working on this know it’s BS, but they also have a work ethic, and try to do the best they can to build the best, cheapest car with their hands tied behind their back. A few people are pushing this agenda, most are simply following to avoid being noticed, since that saying about the tallest blade of grass is very applicable here.

    This reminds me of another phenomenon I see, living and working in Silicon Valley, and that’s around the SJW’s and professional outrageists that are present here in small numbers, but set corporate policies with incessant whining. These are the fat blue haired middle aged women, or the effeminate soy-boys forcing engineering organizations to rename things (words like blacklist, whitelist, master are banned). It’s some kind of delusion, created by these loudmouths, but everyone else goes along. I, for one, have stopped going along. I interviewed a candidate recently who listed his preferred pronouns, and I didn’t use them, so he complained to the company. No biggie, he didn’t get the job, our HR told me to be more respectful next time, and I said no. We live in a crazy world.

    • Hi OL,

      I also know a number of people within the business – mostly middle-managers/engineers. They trust me sufficiently to tell me the same things you have. I feel terrible for them. I know I couldn’t take it. I’d have made faces – and begun to fling poo at them – like a monkey at the zoo that’s finally had enough.

    • ‘words like blacklist, whitelist, master are banned’ — OppositeLock

      Man, I miss slave cylinders. Still have one operating my clutch, never mistreated.

      Though it’ll be called a ‘device bound to involuntary service’ cylinder, should it need replacing.

      Parts have feelings too, you know.

  9. Nonsense. I bought a Tesla model 3 for my wife last year and the $7500 subsidy was phased out long ago. There is no subsidy in North Carolina in any event. We didn’t buy a Tesla to save the world, it’s just that that particular car fits my wife’s lifestyle. She uses it for travel to work, grocery store, getting nails done etc. if we have to take any long trips we use our Toyota Tacoma. The Tesla model 3 is a phenomenal auto but it’s not for everyone.

    • That’s Eric’s whole point – Tesla and GM have used up their 200,000 subsidies, so they’re fighting to reinstate it, because they see sales falling off.

    • Funny, all of my cars can take short OR long trips with no problem. Why would anyone spend MORE money for less function? Very curious.

    • That use case argument- roughly, ‘it fits her lifestyle’- applies just as well at any measure of utility to my bought-used 2015 Mitsubishi Mirage (I love the hilarious Mitsu depreciation when I’m the buyer) or my undying 2000 Corolla.

      May as well try to argue for buying a new iPhone at model launch by telling us that it makes calls and the color matches the wife’s nails. It’s conspicuous consumption; that’s what’s really meant with that mention of lifestyle. The efficiency or ecology tangentially connected is as relevant as it would be for diamond jewelry.

      Speaking of central Africa and conflict minerals…

      • Hi Mike,

        Whether it is conspicuous consumption or not shouldn’t one have a choice how to spend one’s money? I like diamond earrings. I have more than one pair. Is it something I need? Absolutely not. Is it something pretty that I enjoy? Absolutely, yes.

        As long as an individual is willing to get up and go to work or save for what they want they should be able to enjoy the benefits however they see fit. To me there is no difference between the Tesla or any other expensive car (a Ferrari, a Lamborghini, a Viper). They aren’t grocery getters or taking the cat to the vet in one, or even taking the family out for a Sunday drive, but they do have their place. Not everything in life needs to be practical, sometimes fun and enjoyment is the only thing someone needs.

        • I don’t disagree, RG – per se.

          Meaning that I have no objection to indulgences, per se. My Trans Am is one. But the key thing is I paid for it. Every cent. Also, Pontiac was not “mandated” – or artificially induced, via subsidies to build it for me. I criticize Teslas (and electric cars, generally) because they are serially subsidized, at the manufacturing and retail level. They do not exist because of market demand but chiefly because of government demand.

        • RG, the difference between Tesla and something like a Ferrari, etc., is that Tesla exists only due to its ability to engage in extortion and armed robbery in the form of the “carbon credit” shell game. The company loses money on the manufacturing and sales of its cars. If it was not able to mulct money from companies that are actually profitable, Tesla would have closed its doors years ago. Buying a Tesla makes one an accessory to this racketeering.

          As Eric said the electric boondoggle has come about not due to market demand, but by government diktat. That’s what is being criticized.

          • Hi Jason,

            GM would have closed their doors years ago as well without the backing of taxpayer funds after the 2008 free fall.

            I am 100% against the involvement of government into any type of private business. If I were President in 2008 there would have been a lot less corporations than there are today….AIG, BOA, Goldman Sachs, GM, goners. Too big to fail – no such thing.

            I do not agree with the tax credits offered by Uncle Sam with our taxpayer money for electric vehicles. I also do not agree with them for the 2008 to 2020 energy improvements to one’s primary residence, the child tax credit, the EITC, the tuition credit, the mortgage interest deduction, charitable contribution deduction, etc. I also despise how local and state governments use our money to lure sports teams like the NFL and NBA to town by offering tax incentives on nice new stadiums when most of our streets can’t get paved. How much in subsidies do farmers receive or better yet the fuel industry? The list goes on and on. Every large industry has been touched (and destroyed) by Uncle’s gnarly evil hand.

            My view on Tesla was they created an interesting product. Whatever one things of Musk he is a smart man and credits would not have been offered without such a product already designed and manufactured. I can separate the car from the incentives as I do every time I walk up to a fuel pump or into a bank’s lobby.

            • Hi RG,

              I see the Tesla(s) differently. Leaving aside the issues of mandates and subsidies, the styling is derivative and the build quality notoriously erratic and often shoddy. The interiors are dominated by a large, centrally mounted touchscreen that is both ugly and functionally appalling in that tapping/swiping to control the functions of a moving vehicle – on a screen that is not even line-of-sight – is difficult and dangerous. Any other car company would have been roasted alive by the so-called “consumer” press for it.

              The one objective thing that Teslas can tout is that the cars are very quick. But what is the point of that in view of the fact that using that quickness to its full extent will rapidly deplete the battery, forcing the owner to stop – and wait – for an absurdly long time before the car can be driven again, at all?

              What would the “consumer” press say about a BMW M5 with a 5 gallon gas tank that had to be refilled with a turkey baster?

              • Hi Eric,

                All very valid points, but it boils down to personal preference. One man’s Medusa could be another man’s Aphrodite.

                What someone finds interesting, entertaining, fun, or even just practical should not have to pass a smell test for those that disagree. As long as the individual makes the choice and it doesn’t affect the choices of the rest of us isn’t that what we are fighting for?

                • I agree, RG!

                  But, I maintain that Tesla people are making excuses for the thing. How many would willingly put up with sketchy build quality from, say, Lexus or Mercedes? The stuff Tesla has pawned off in that regard would have destroyed the reputation of any other high-end brand. How many would put up with – per my earlier point – a high-performance car that could only travel around 200 miles before you had to stop and wait for potentially hours to get back on the road again?

                  It’s a case of the people pretending the Emperor’s new clothes are just gorgeous!

            • I was against the GM bailout of course, but that’s in the past and can’t be changed. (Fortunately being a non-taxpayer I wasn’t mulcted for that one.) The carbon credit extortion scam that keeps Tesla afloat, on the other hand, has been ongoing since that company’s inception.

              If Musk had built and sold his electric car without utilizing armed gangsters and thugs to rob others to pay for it that would be a different matter. However, he did not do that and continues to pick the pockets of others in order to continue building his “interesting product”.

              • I am not defending Musk by any means, but the tax credits (which are no longer in existence) were offered to ALL car makers that made an electric vehicle, not just Tesla.

                I am attaching the list below:

                https://fueleconomy.gov/feg/taxevb.shtml#:~:text=Filter%20table%20by%E2%80%A6%20%20%20%20Vehicle%20Make,%20%20%E2%80%93%20%2022%20more%20rows%20

                GM, Volkswagen, Aldi, Beemer, Chrysler, Ford, etc. I took just as many tax credits for Volvo and Volkswagen that I did for Tesla. If we are to be upset at anybody how about the legislative branch that writes the tax laws and controls the purse strings?

                • Just an FYI there are a few new ones on there – can anyone say Mustang Mach E? A tax credit of $7500, too and good for this year!

                • Tax credits are not the same as carbon credits. As I said, the carbon credit scam is ongoing.

                  The idea of using tax credits to single out and give favor to manufacturers and buyers of a particular type of vehicle is just another example of the gangsters callings themselves “government” manipulating the market in defiance of its own gang rules that require all be treated equally under the law.

                  • Hi Jason,

                    I will admit my knowledge of carbon credits is limited, but isn’t this a pretty voluntary program for the green people?

                    How does this affect us who don’t wish to participate? I am sincerely asking.

                    • It’s a government scheme under which companies that produce products emitting harmless CO2 (such as gasoline-powered cars) are penalized by government unless they buy “credits” from a company (such as Tesla) whose products do not emit CO2. This has enabled Tesla to make money by selling these phony “credits” to other companies in order to keep themselves in business, since sales of their cars is otherwise a losing proposition.
                      Without the force of government behind it there is no way that Tesla would be able to pull off this kind of extortion racket.

                      It’s a government-imposed mulcting scheme from beginning to end designed to manipulate the market by giving favor to products that otherwise would be uncompetitive.

                      Other than the force being applied to manipulate the market there would be little interest in electric cars by the general public.

        • Certainly, one is free to indulge so. (I, myself, want to nab a cheap Miata for naught but giggles, if I can find one at an appealing balance of condition and cost.)

          Just as certainly, I am free to express my contempt for such indulgence if I perceive it to be a simple fad.

          As for Musk himself as an icon of innovation- please, spare me. The man made his money by good fate, not brilliance or skill. (For the uninitiated, he co-ran a dot-com in the late nineties which merged with another dot-com, and that *other* dot-com made what would eventually become PayPal after being sold to eBay. He had already been thrown off the board by the time of that asset sale for incessantly micromanaging IT decisions- in a dot-com, core to the whole business- and generally making a nuisance of himself, but he retained options and so enjoyed a nice windfall from the sale. Not only did he not make the tech or service, his company didn’t, and he had generally just been a PITA to everyone else that did. Just right place, right time.) His only consistent skill- like Steve Jobs- has been to marshal hordes of engineers to his whimsy- easy enough when you have the capital- and to raise capital- see above. He did not found Tesla, he did not engineer any of the product or process, he has invented nothing. He’s famous, and people love throwing money at him. He’s basically Walt Disney, but overtly on the spectrum and closer to realizing his oddball cyberpunk EPCOT. Don’t tell me about American innovation and Musk at once, unless it is to provide contrast or a cautionary tale about personality and branding being conflated with actual technical merit.

    • Hi LSI,

      Welcome to the site if you are new here. 🙂

      As you can see from the responses above not everybody is a lover of electric vehicles. 😉 I don’t own a Tesla, but I know several people who do and it is a fun car. I applaud Musk for having a vision of designing something new and contemporary. American innovativeness is what has set our country apart from the rest of the world for generations. As you stated the Model 3 isn’t for everyone, but it does hold its place in history and allows people the greatest of all things….a choice.

      Since January 2020 no tax credit has been offered on any of the Tesla models and they have been purchased under free will. I would also argue they were purchased under that same freewill even with the tax credit and I don’t blame anyone for taking advantage of the tax code where they can.

      I am glad it works for your wife. For in town cruising and short distances it does what it should. As someone who just spent an hour tonight cruising around with her husband looking for gas for his work truck so he could get to the job tomorrow, your wife is laughing at the rest of us right now. Looking at the coming days and weeks ahead until the pipeline is fixed I may need to contact a few of those friends with one and see if they are willing to give me a lift to work.

  10. Just to prove the point — the day after Hong Kong stopped subsidizing electric cars, all sales of Tesla’s just STOPPED! LOL. This has been so stupid; electric cars tried to compete in the 19-teens and lost out to internal combustion then for all of the same flaws that remain today! Simple reason: electric cars in effect must carry the weight of both their propellant and their oxidizer. Internal combustion engines get the 5/6’s (approximately) of the fuel weight from the atmosphere, and consequently only need to carry the propellant (1/6th of the weight.)

  11. The zen of electric vehicle buying; totally absent, not there at all, never will be.

    Not much zen involved in thinking about buying an electric vehicle, not going to buy one at all, don’t have to think about it either.

    Things going kinetic in Jerusalem today too. So much fun!

    Gas war has taken on a whole new meaning for now.

  12. ‘Which leaves Elon with a money problem …’ — EP

    But not his only problem. A few days ago in China, video showed a Tesla bearing down on a freight truck from behind at two or three times the truck’s speed. Closing the gap in microseconds, the Tesla smacked the truck like a mosquito hitting a bug zapper, pulping the EV’s ‘driver’ on the spot.

    Chinese state-run media jumped on the case, publishing a grisly photo of the mangled vehicle for all to see. Now Bloomberg says that Tesla canceled a planned land purchase to expand its factory in Shanghai, as its sales in China slide.

    No one could possibly have seen this coming. /sarc

    This morning Tesla shares are getting whackoed, stomped back down to $600 (from a high of $900 in January) as punters wake up and smell the coffee on this astonishing scam that (temporarily) made Elon one of the richest lifeforms on the planet.

    Speaking of Elon, he tweeted this morning, ‘Do you want to Tesla to accept Doge[coin]?’

    Ah ha ha ha … effing clown … take a high-speed ride in the back seat of a driverless Tesla on autopilot. Billionaire kebab!

    • We happened to get a rental once, IIRC Wisconsin somewhere, luck of the draw. I remember that opening the windows or sunroof at highway speeds caused the car to shudder and make noise. Back hatch was a pain in butt too.

  13. If the supreme court says you can be forced to buy health insurance or pay a tax for not buying so will the same for the auto industry. You can either buy and own an electric or be taxed because you didn’t.
    Be taxed because you didn’t jab.
    Be taxed because you moved to a non-covid state.
    Be taxed because you are the wrong color.
    Be taxed because you are the wrong class.

    • Well-said, Hans –

      The principle is, indeed, the same – and it will be applied, generally. I fully expect it to become mandatory to buy home and life insurance, too. To further enserf the populace.

      Insurance – per se – is not an inherently bad thing. But when it is made mandatory, it is an evil thing. I maintain that one of the major reasons for most people being broke relates to how much they’re forced to spend on “coverage.”

  14. Well, a perfectly timed “gas shortage” due to a mysterious “cyber attack” hitting right when the “pandemic” is supposedly “ending” and inflation is spiking just might make those rubes buy electric… ya think?

    https://www.cbsnews.com/news/ransomware-attack-on-pipeline-propels-gas-to-near-3-a-gallon/

    I’m not sure what to make of this. I don’t know if it’s real or not. I’m not a conspiracy theorist, but frankly I don’t trust what the government tells me. Unfortunately the average person has no way of independently verifying or debunking the “official story.”

    But it sure as hell would be mighty convenient for the electric car agenda if you couldn’t get gas… wouldn’t it?

    (Coincidentally enough, Obama apparatchik Hah-vahd bigwig Cass Sunstein explicitly advocated the government “nudging” the sheep to do the “right” thing “for their own good”: https://www.amazon.com/Nudge-Improving-Decisions-Health-Happiness/dp/014311526X )

    • Hi X,

      This scenario crossed my mind, too. How else to sell electric vehicles, but to take the fuel away from the gasoline powered ones. Yesterday, I took all of our vehicles and topped them off. My husband has a truck that he rarely drives, but it was down to a 1/4 tank. It cost us $70 to put diesel in it, but we have an extra mode of transportation if necessary. I am a person who usually doesn’t fill up until the fuel light comes on, but lately, I won’t let the tank get below a 1/2 tank before I am back at the pump. I am not as antsy about the price as I am a gasoline shortage. What do we do at that point?

      • “They” are saying it was “the Russians” who did it. Perhaps, but it would not surprise me at all to find that said “Russians” were hired by the current regime to do the hit. Nothing is off the table when it comes to saving the planet, don’t you know.

        I’m old enough to have lived through the phony 1970s gasoline shortages. Back then like a lot of other people I picked up a cheap used puddle jumper to get through. (Even rigged up a rheostat to control the gas gauge since you couldn’t get gas until your tank was less than 1/2 full.) That won’t be possible this time thanks to the scamdemic turning both the new and used car markets upside-down.

        • Hi Jason,

          This country does like blaming the Russians for everything. I am not denying it isn’t, but what kind of data would a Russian ring need to be able to access a large US pipeline? It is just too coincidental with all that is happening.

          Also, why do we have major pipelines and electrical grids online? Maybe it is time to go back to pen and paper and manual overrides.

          • I seriously doubt it’s the Russkies. It COULD be, of course; in the day and age of the internet everybody is ALWAYS trying to hack everybody else. Hell, the U.S. has a “Cyber Command.” Israel (probably along with the CIA) hacked the Iranian nuke program. Every corporate and government network everywhere employs full-time IT people to defend against constant cyber attacks. So it wouldn’t surprise me if there WAS some kind of cyber attack on the pipeline, based purely on the the fact that hack attempts happen every day.

            However, government likes to use events to spook the herd and as pretexts to do things that they wanted to do anyway but couldn’t. I don’t know if 9/11 was an inside job or not, but it sue as hell created a convenient pretext for domestic spying, the creation of the DHS bureaucracy, the expansion of the military budget, the militarization of the police, a permanent warfare footing, and accusing your political enemies of being “domestic terrorists.”

            For the Deep State, 9/11 was a gift from heaven.

            Same is true with the supposed pipeline hack causing a gas shortage. If these people wanted us to have gas, they would have completed the Keystone pipeline instead of cancelling it. They would encourage fracking instead of banning it. They would not be handing out tax credits for electric cars that don’t sell.

            Whether the pipeline hack is real or not, either way does anyone really think they want to “fix” the problem, or are they saying to themselves “Well, if the rubes can’t get their fossil fuels, they’ll just have to buy electric. Perfect!”

        • The Russians might have bought up a bunch of futures contracts and are looking for yield. There are funds that made out like bandits on the Texas cock-up. But that’s never mentioned.

        • I doubt there was ever a hack. This was on purpose by our own enemies within. It’s a psy-op to prep everyone for the next phase of their plans. I have a feeling the word “cyber” is about to be used as much as “weapons of mass destruction” was used.

    • I never got this – how can one pipeline being down cause shortages and price spikes across the country. From what I remember about the fuel supply network in the US its very distributed, ie if a line goes down tankers are able to cover till its back up. Most of those tanker owners and drivers are small and medium size, relatively independent.. I suspect there is some government screwing around….

      • All round the world, pipelines are difficult to construct, in terms of both cost and regulatory approvals.

        Political wars over the Canada-US Keystone XL pipeline, and the Russia-Germany Nord Stream 2 pipeline, illustrate the point.

        So pipelines, if approved, are built big; as big as possible. Colonial Pipeline is one such, carrying petroleum products from where they are refined in Texas and Louisiana to consumers along the east coast.

        Unlike the internet, pipelines offer no seamless rerouting around an inoperative node. They just go dark, instantly and brutally. Ask our friends the Ukies! 🙂

      • Nasir,

        There are not enough truckers in the US to move all gas needed from TX to the eastern states of the us. Especially considering you need a special certificate to be able to haul flammable materials like gasoline and when the amazons and walmarts of the world having most of the us truck fleet hauling cheap chinese garbage across the country so that noone gets upset when their “free” 3 day shipping turns into 4 or 5 days.

        • Unlikely to come to anything, those. The signature verification process was dropped by the acquiescence of state politicians, so it’s literally just going to be a recount of what was already recounted before without any inquiry or inspection as to propriety.

          Some politicos seem to want to be able to say they did something- or tried to- without actually upsetting the apple cart, to be seen to do something rather than to do something. I don’t place much import in it, not as it is actually being carried out.

    • I got two things about that supposed cyber attack. First of all, I *am* a cybersecurity professional. The idea that these systems were wide open (as is being suggested) is fallacious. Secondly, I’m also a futures trader. While this artificial “attack” has been billed as so hugely disastrous and disruptive, the funny thing is that the gasoline futures market has sold off the last couple days. Things are not adding up. And when things don’t add up, somebody is bullshitting. More likely than not (IMO) some left-sympathetic (and Great Reset minded) US Govt. institution (e.g., CIA/NSA/FBI) has manufactured this “attack”. I don’t believe one word of it.

      • My question is “were the ‘Control systems’ air gapped?” If not, why not? Was the IT team asleep or naive? Did the upper office suit wearers force convenience over security? Didn’t want to spend money to protect bonuses maybe? Users clicking on email links ect? Happened to a local County gov. near me. Police, FBI, and Homeland were all useless.
        I agree, the root cause needs to be found.

    • Prior to Nahn-levn the biggest terrorist threats came from the environmental/animal rights whack jobs. Monkey wrenching forests, attacking research facilities and the rest were their raison d’etre. It’s not beyond comprehension that they are back and using cyber piracy to effect the changes they desire.

      No Colonial pipeline? How do you like your Green New Deal now?

  15. Meanwhile, Harley Davidson figured out that the Livewire was going to destroy the brand so they spun it out as a separate business. Ford and GM could learn a thing or two from HD. Make your electric division a different entity, not something that has to compete side-by-side with superior vehicles. And certainly do not destroy brand names that have become legendary.

    https://www.theverge.com/2021/5/10/22428750/harley-davidson-livewire-electric-motorcycle-brand

      • I really never got that (especially the Mustang thing you wrote about earlier). They could have easily created something like the “Geo” cars in the 80s which from what I recall were small, ultra efficient japanese cars that just wouldn’t suit GM ! Or Mercedes’ Smart brand…. i guess it has something to do with the fact that they actually want to kill off real cars…

    • On my Facebook feed, I saw a story that HD was building (my words) “tribute editions” of motorcycles. Starting off with the Electra Glide and 1950’s era paint job and chromework and that white “buddy seat”. Of course with modern motor and (probably) stroker, and other performance goodies too. Big bucks, but all the replies in the Facebook thread were enthusiastically positive. Looking forward to 2025, when my 2000 Dyna Glide attains “Classic” status!

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